Breadmaking Machines

[SteveShaw]

The machine that won all the plaudits in the UK was the Panasonic SD253. We bought one and it makes superb bread. Shop bread is just not in the running for us any more.

[Flyingcursor]

I've had one for years. It's great but I have no idea what they run nowdays.

[DCrom]

Lambchop, I agree with you about mixes. However -

All the breads I make are from scratch and with the best ingredients I can get. I tend to agree about plain white bread - though the bread machine version is better, it's still just plain white bread.

My homemade sourdough white (when I make it) is a lot better than any commercial white bread I've tried. Ditto for my homemade oatmeal bread, or dried olive-onion bread, or any of the other favorites.

And there's something addictive to waking up in the morning to the scent of just-baked bread, even if it's the relatively plebian white loaf.

[Flyingcursor]

...and with the best ingredients I can get.

Queue SteveShaw.

So is the flour you spend twice as much on really that much better than the local supermarket brand? I'd have to taste it to believe it. It's all powdered wheat.

[Miwokhill]

the one on amazon I'd mentioned that got the best reviews is the SD250...sounds like it might be basically the same model SteveShaw mentioned.

I'd probably get it but will be spending any disposable income on the great motorola deals the guy on the traditional instrument forum is offering now.

[SteveShaw]

...and with the best ingredients I can get.

Queue SteveShaw.

So is the flour you spend twice as much on really that much better than the local supermarket brand? I'd have to taste it to believe it. It's all powdered wheat.

[Sliabh Luachra]

...and with the best ingredients I can get.

Queue SteveShaw.

So is the flour you spend twice as much on really that much better than the local supermarket brand? I'd have to taste it to believe it. It's all powdered wheat.

Yes, yes it is absolutely is better.

Mark

[bradhurley]

So is the flour you spend twice as much on really that much better than the local supermarket brand? I'd have to taste it to believe it. It's all powdered wheat.

Most flour you buy in the supermarket is many months old, made from wheat that was probably old before it was turned into flour. Fresh high-quality flour is as different from supermarket flour as pre-ground Maxwell House in a can is different from fresh-ground French-roasted arabica.

[Denny]

if you do not have the palate to differentiate
then save both time and money





ya gotta love this country!

[Lambchop]

So is the flour you spend twice as much on really that much better than the local supermarket brand? I'd have to taste it to believe it. It's all powdered wheat.

Well, no, not all flour you spend twice as much on is better. A lot of expensive flour is not much better than the local supermarket brand--it's just got a high price tag.

I buy King Arthur flour at my local grocery, where it's not much more expensive than the regular kind. My grocery is unusual in that it stocks it because of customer demand.

One difference between GOOD flour and something like Gold Medal is that the good flour isn't rancid and stale. The oils haven't gone bad. You may not be able to taste and smell this, but I can. Consumption of rancid oils isn't good for you.

It isn't bleached or bromated, either.

Another difference is in the flour itself. Good flour is made to be good for specific purposes. There is flour that is best for bread in general or best for a certain type of bread. There is flour that is best for pastries, or for rustic bread, or for farmhouse white.

It's not just powdered, but is ground to a specific size that is best for a specific purpose.

It's made from a higher grade of wheat and from specific types of wheat, too, so that the performance characteristics of the flour are best for what you want to make.

I've made bread from regular flour and from good flour. There is no comparison--the good flour is just in another universe with respect to quality and performance.

There is a FAQ on the King Arthur Flour website. It's good reading.

[I.D.10-t]

For making bread, this is what I do.
In the morning,

Take a 1 1/2C liquid (water, milk*, egg, etc) Most typically I use a cup of milk, one egg and and 3 Tbsp. Butter**.

Add a spoonful of yeast if you don’t have a starter (amount really doesn't matter as it is alive and will make more). You can add sweetener (sugar molasses, syrup, honey) at this point, but too much will slow down the yeast. Keep in mind that some sweeteners (like honey) also count as liquids


Add a pinch of salt if you want and 1 1/2C grains and flour and 2C of bread flour*** and mix. I am lazy and just stir the stuff together and let it sit till I get back from work. Hopefully you made the mixture in a big enough bowl so that when you come home it hasn’t bubbled all over the counter.

I now knead the bread for about 5 minutes and add flour if needed until it wants to stick to itself more than my hands. At this point you can mix in herbs, nuts, or other things for flavor. I either make a round type loaf or place the dough into a bread pan. A good skillet with an oven proof handle can also can make a good form (visionwear and cast iron seem to work well****). Either way grease the form and let the dough rise in it until double in size. Bake at 375 for 45 minutes or until done (when taken out of the pan or whatever it should make a hollow sound when thumped and should pull out easily).

The actual time of making the bread is probably 30 minutes of five minute steps spread through out the day and in between doing other things.

Three things I have wondered about machines. Flour varies in moisture content and kneading the dough is when you adjust for this. Is this just ignored when bread machines are used?

If somehow the yeast is killed, do you just end up with a flour brick?

How does the machine grease the pan?

*Milk has enzymes that can cause slower yeast productivity so it is best to scald the milk first and let it cool if used.
**Fat helps the keeping properties and makes it so the bread doesn't seem dry if the loaf lasts for more than two days.
***You can use sun flower seeds, flax, oatmeal, whole wheat, rhy, buckwheat flour, or other grain filler if you want the bread flower holds it together. Seeds tend to soak up less liquid so more flour may be needed.
****One thing that I have wondered about is if there is a size limit to to making bread. I have a 10 quart dutch oven that I would love to make a huge loaf of bread in. Perhaps baking at 325 for 2 hours?

[Loren]

Cool, lots of great info, thanks everyone!

Mark, hey man, I make fun of other people's ages so I'm not thinking about my own advancing age so much!


Loren

[SteveShaw]

If you have a breadmaker it makes sense to use the best ingredients you can get hold of. That means organic wholemeal flour or unbleached organic white flour. It needs to be "strong" for good breadmaking by machine. The ones I buy in the UK are sold under the Dove's Farm brand, and it tells you on the bag if it's suitable for breadmaking machines. It takes about three minutes to weigh, measure and load your ingredients into a breadmaker - end of labour. Five hours later (and the Panasonic 253 has a timer that can delay your bread for up to 13 hours from the moment you hit the "start" button, so you can craftily set it up before you hit the sack), and your loaf is ready to come out, filling the house with a wonderful aroma. You need to let it cool for about an hour before slicing it and eating it for breakfast, still warm, with loads of butter and thick-cut marmalade and all washed down with a pot of tea. Drool at that thought. It is much cheaper to make an organic wholemeal loaf in a breadmaking machine than it is to buy one, and your loaf will be much better. Less salty for a start, which is something I've come to appreciate about breadmaker bread. I like unsalted butter on my bread, too, and plenty of it.

[KateG]

Good flour is definately worth it, and I second the recommendation for King Arthur's (if you're in the USofA). I use their stone ground for my 100% whole wheat bread, and it's wonderful. Much more flavor and texture than Pillsbury's or Gold Medal whole wheat; specially on the texture front.

My standard recipe calls for 6 c. whole wheat flour and 2 tsp. salt stirred together. Then mix 2 cups warm water with 2 tablespoons each of oil and honey in a big measuring cup, and 1 packet or tablespoon of yeast dissolved in 3/4 c. warm water in a smaller measuring cup (give the yeast a few minutes to wake up, and if it sulks try with another batch of yeast before proceeding). Knead the water into the flour and keep kneading for about 20 minutes if you're doing it by hand, or 6 minutes if you're using a stand mixer. Let rise til double in size, punch down and let rise again. Then divide into two loaves and bake in greased 8 1/2 x 4 pans. (approx. -- the medium sized ones). Start them in a 425 oven for 10 minutes, then turn down to 350 for about 45 minutes. Cool on a rack, then enjoy. This makes nicely risen plain loaves that are not too sweet or greasy.

I do three batches in one session, since my oven will hold six loaves. It's not much more work than making one batch, especially with my trusty KitchenAid, and that gives me nearly a month's bread for one day's monitoring. With 100% whole wheat flour the trick is to knead it a LOT, and to make slightly smaller loaves than you would with white flour since the bran interferes with the gluten strands to a certain extent....trying to eat peanuts and chew gum simultaneously, was how one cookbook writer put it.

But however you make bread...there's nothing like it. Nothing says "home" like a house or apartment full of new baked bread smells.

[Rod Sprague]

I had a mediocre bread machine. The bread was good hot, but cold it had that spongy texture that makes most store bought bread completely unpalatable to me. It was likely the fact it couldn’t nurse the bread through the proper rising cycles to get a good texture. It had a timer, which was nice, and it had a setting for simply kneading and incubating the rising of the bread for an hour. I was pressed for time the next day when I would make the bread, but had my schedule set up to get the bread done in time for a late morning potluck. I couldn’t get in the first mixing and rising of the dough without getting up too early. I was going to bake the bread in the oven after nursing the bread through a couple of risings while doing some other stuff at home and show up to the potluck with a warm loaf of bread. I put the ingredients into the machine that evening, with the yeast on top, so it wouldn’t come in contact with the liquids in till the machine came on and mixed everything. I turned the machine to the knead and rise setting and reached the point at which I was going to enter the length of time before it would come on. I wanted it to come on in time for me to get out of bed at a reasonable hour to get the dough after its first rising. When I got the point I was supposed to enter the time, it simply skipped to the start of the mixing. The designers of the thing had actually gone to the trouble of eliminating the timer on the knead and rise setting, I believe because they lacked the imagination to realize someone might have a good reason for the thing to start up in that setting when someone wasn’t there to do that manually.

Rod