Tell us something.: You just slip out the back, Jack Make a new plan, Stan You don't need to be coy, Roy Just get yourself free Hop on the bus, Gus You don't need to discuss much Just drop off the key, Lee And get yourself free
Pekkos wrote: Has anyone done research of what happens with the internal intonation of a flute if one has one cold end and one hot end of the instrument?
/Anders
Umm, define "hot"? I mean, wood typically doesn't get real hot, at least not without bursting into flames.......
What i mean is that if you pick up and play a cold flute, it will warm up more faster in the head-joint and more slowly in the far end. I was thinking that this might have an effect since speed of sound is very much temperature dependent, and thus the wavelegth of a certain frequency too
/Anders
c=331.6+0.6*t [m/s] (t= temperature in Celsius)
l=c/f [m]
this is for open air, will be a bit different in tubes
pmcallis wrote:Jack,
Please explain more about the impact of "faced" and "unfaced" corks on the sound of a flute...and Jon, feel free to add your views too.
Paul
Pekkos wrote:I have a collegue working on an acoustic refrigerator, the principle works, but not very efficently, so I doubt that the termal properties of the flute material will make any difference big enough to notice, but who knows... The biggest difference I can think of is the time it takes to warm up the flute. Has anyone done research of what happens with the internal intonation of a flute if one has one cold end and one hot end of the instrument?
/Anders
I thought I heard via the grapevine that someone made a big breakthru there with a different cavity resonator shape...got any reference ????
I would think they would be a good source of the optimum pressure face material esp. for thermal conductivity.
603/329-7322
"I fail to see why doing the same thing over and over and getting the
same results every time is insanity: I've almost proved it isn't;
only a few more tests now and I'm sure results will differ this time ... "
Tell us something.: You just slip out the back, Jack Make a new plan, Stan You don't need to be coy, Roy Just get yourself free Hop on the bus, Gus You don't need to discuss much Just drop off the key, Lee And get yourself free
Pekkos wrote:What i mean is that if you pick up and play a cold flute, it will warm up more faster in the head-joint and more slowly in the far end. I was thinking that this might have an effect since speed of sound is very much temperature dependent, and thus the wavelegth of a certain frequency too
/Anders
c=331.6+0.6*t [m/s] (t= temperature in Celsius)
l=c/f [m]
this is for open air, will be a bit different in tubes
Sorry Anders, I was just joking around, I know what you meant
pmcallis wrote:Jack,
Please explain more about the impact of "faced" and "unfaced" corks on the sound of a flute...and Jon, feel free to add your views too.
Paul
The bigio site has always been interesting......but no quantitative data.....there are a number of effects in that type of setup which could cause secondary resonances which (unlike those of the flute body) could shift some notes slightly in frequency and "Q" (ie. bandwidth) The player might feel these as different as he compensates for these small variations...etc etc.....
It would be fun to put some of these on the spectrometer someday.....
603/329-7322
"I fail to see why doing the same thing over and over and getting the
same results every time is insanity: I've almost proved it isn't;
only a few more tests now and I'm sure results will differ this time ... "
I think that there's too much player in the equation!
I've read many Boehm player accounts of trying different materials on different flutes...most seemed to think that the crown/stopper helped but which one was all over the board.
Another difference I have noticed between Prattens and Nicholsons is in sweetness of the second octave. [...] Prattens have honking volume but a comewhat diffuse second octave (not totally clear, no matter how hard you try).
Both of my Olwell Prattens -- one lined and one not -- have very sweet and clear second octaves.
If you're still here, I wonder if you might say something about
how the flutes compare.
If you're still here, I wonder if you might say something about how the flutes compare.
Sure.
Flute #1 is Patrick's basic model in boxwood. No rings or keys or tuning slide. It's about ten years old. Flute #2 is blackwood with six keys and the usual lined headjoint with tuning slide; I got the headjoint (attached to a keyless flute) in 1998, and the keyed sections were finished in 2000. Both flutes are well broken in and get played a lot.
My perception is that they're about equal in volume. I find the lined flute to be a little more responsive, and the tone is brighter and cleaner. The unlined boxwood sounds warm and rich. It's not as penetrating as the lined flute, but when you push it it gives this amazing throaty roar. I tend to play flute #2 more because it has keys, but while it's a truly awesome instrument, I'd have to say I find flute #1 generally more satisfying to play. I just love the sound of that thing.
Speaking of truly awesome instruments, has anybody taken Josh up on his trade?
You guys look like you're having fun! Oh... I'll soon return back to the land of the living!
I have an Olwell Pratten Blackwood Keyless which is just sweet. I have been having wanderlust though thinking about trying a Nicholson... I've played a few and love them all. The main thing I like is that the big tone is still there while the finger holes are slightly smaller which suits my med hands...
Ok, back from procrastinating... I was in the middle of putting a bunch of junk up on craigslist (cleaning out the basement) when I thought I'd check in on you guys...
I've barely played since I returned from Ireland (trad that is...) I've had to plan two weddings worth of music and have been back and forth to Georgia spending time with my grandmother who just passed away - 96 years - good years... End of an era...
Tell us something.: I restore 19th century flutes, specializing in Rudall & Rose, and early American flutes. I occasionally make new flutes. Been at it for about 15 years.
McChastain wrote:You guys look like you're having fun! Oh... I'll soon return back to the land of the living!
I have an Olwell Pratten Blackwood Keyless which is just sweet. I have been having wanderlust though thinking about trying a Nicholson... I've played a few and love them all. The main thing I like is that the big tone is still there while the finger holes are slightly smaller which suits my med hands...
Ok, back from procrastinating... I was in the middle of putting a bunch of junk up on craigslist (cleaning out the basement) when I thought I'd check in on you guys...
I've barely played since I returned from Ireland (trad that is...) I've had to plan two weddings worth of music and have been back and forth to Georgia spending time with my grandmother who just passed away - 96 years - good years... End of an era...
Well... off to being productive.
Best,
Welcome back Blayne!
Sorry to hear of your loss, but that is a good long life, my grandmother lived to be 99.9 years, before passing...
I got to play a Olwell Nickolson's, very nice flute. The holes, save the F# are not very large. I think the F# was around 11 mm on this Olwell, as it was an earlier model.
I bet you have a lot of good stories of your college experence in the Emerld Isle...
Jon
Loren wrote:Oh geeze, here we go getting all high tech: "Thermal Loss" "Ceramic stoppers"..... What's next, Supercooled Adamantium/Unobtainium alloy, space folding, dimension bridging stoppers?
Loren
Thank you, Loren, for asking the question. It so happens that I have been working on a revolutionary new concept in flute-stopper design. The basic materials that I use have not changed; I still use slightly-adapted, used wine corks. However, before inserting the stopper into the head of the flute I place the stopper in a specially-made chamber to "energize" the stopper. Of course, at this point it is a secret process. I call the energizing space a SEA (subtle energy activiating) chamber. After the stopper has been in the chamber for 13 hours and is fully energized it is placed in the flute in the normal fashion. I am sure that you are curious about results. My assessment is that the newly designed stopper produces a remarkable change in the sound of the flute, but, unfortunately, the changes are so subtle that I am afraid that most listeners would not be able to detect them. But, believe me, they are there. I also am thinking about offering a deluxe model of the SEA flute stopper, which will have a super, rare-earth magnet attached to the inner surface of the stopper. My theory is that the super magnetic will act as a kind of supercharger for the flute. However, I might add, that the deluxe model is still in the design stage.
Doug, will it make your flutes louder
than say an Olwell or a Hamilton Pratten,
or loud enough to make "mikes crackle" so
that CDs would only contain tracks that I
wasn't actually playing on?
Which of the two, the SEA or the
super, rare-earth magnet deluxe model
would be the loudest?
"It might be a bit better to tune to one of my fiddle's open strings, like A, rather than asking me for an F#." - Martin Milner
Doug_Tipple wrote: It so happens that I have been working on a revolutionary new concept in flute-stopper design. The basic materials that I use have not changed; I still use slightly-adapted, used wine corks. However, before inserting the stopper into the head of the flute I place the stopper in a specially-made chamber to "energize" the stopper. Of course, at this point it is a secret process. I call the energizing space a SEA (subtle energy activiating) chamber. After the stopper has been in the chamber for 13 hours and is fully energized.....
Ummm, Doug. I believe you're working on my new flute today. Are you sure it's not going to be radioactive.....?
Charlie Gravel
“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.”
― Oscar Wilde
"It might be a bit better to tune to one of my fiddle's open strings, like A, rather than asking me for an F#." - Martin Milner
