Erection problems

[rorybbellows]

Here in Ireland if you want to erect a shed or add a house extension you have to draw up plans submit them to the local planning council then wait for their permission ,then there is a further waiting time to see if there will be any objection from neighbours.All in all it’s a very long drawn out process.
Is it the same in other parts of the world ???


RORY

[Walden]

It varies here, but it's about like that if you're going to build in town.

[Martin Milner]

I don't think you need planning permission for a shed in the UK, but you do for alterations to the house, such as an extension or conservatory.

I know you need planning permission for a wind turbine on the roof, not sure about solar panels or a satellite dish.

[Innocent Bystander]

Yep, Martin. You need planning permission if it is to be more than ten feet high. That includes sheds, and garage extensions.

Two of our neighbours (in Bucks, UK) are in a spat which has come to include one's vertical garage extension, in which he keeps his kayaks. He's had it for ages, and didn't realise he needed permission. The law is inclined to be lenient if it has been standing for ten years or more. His opponent was claiming he had only just put it up. We were able to furnish him with proof (photographs of ten years ago) showing it had been there a long time.

And my sister-in-law in Manchester was extremely peeved to find that she needed planning permission to knock through a wall between her lounge and dining-room. She didn't seem to twig that the neighbours might be concerned if her house fell down...

When I was in Edinburgh, I used to spend a lot of time researching in the Dean of Guilds, which is where they post the architectural drawings for this kind of thing. It's a reasonable way of finding out how the buildings are put together.

[emmline]

Remember that scene in Kate and Leopold where Liev Schreiber is in the past as a time traveler, watching a new tower go up?
You just brought that to mind.

[Whistlin'Dixie]

We have such restrictions in my town.

Did anyone see the recently released movie, Friends With Money?

There's an amusing scene in which the angry neighbor invites her remodeling friend over to check out the new "view" from her window.....

M

[Jerry Freeman]

We have codes enforcement officers for each township. If you're going to make any structural changes or build something, you get a building permit, but it's not a public review process where neighbors can make trouble. Some townships and villages have town or village planning boards, and the process there can be more complicated, depending on what you want to do.

Generally, however, if what you want to do is permitted by zoning and building codes, you just show the codes enforcement officer your plans (or tell him, if they're really simple), you pay a fee (typically $50 or $75), and he hands you a permit. At various stages in the construction, he comes to inspect and confirm that you're doing what you said you would do, in compliance with the relevant building codes (foundations, wiring, etc.).

Many of the townships around here have zoning ordinances prohibiting the installation of mobile homes older than a certain age (typically 15 years), which interferes with my ability to make a living, since I am in the business of reconditioning and selling mobile homes.

I had heard from people in the mobile home business that these age restriction ordinances are not legal, but no one could figure out how to challenge them.

Every mobile home manufactured since July 15, 1976 is built to the same national specifications, and a municipality may, and all of them do, lawfully require that the home be certified to comply with the national specifications (they have a metal certification plate on the back). However, there's no difference between a home that's 16 years old and one that's 14 years old except that some townships will refuse the 16 year old home and accept the 14 year old home.

Eventually, I was able to discuss this with the man who's in charge of manufactured housing regulations with the state of New York, and he agreed that the age restriction ordinances are unlawful, but he didn't think anything much could be done short of taking each township to court. However, he did refer me to an attorney in the state government's building codes division. It took about two weeks to get that attorney on the phone after faxing him a detailed letter. He also told me the same thing after he had checked it with an other government attorney who specializes in zoning issues.

Basically, he said, "The ordinances are wrong, but good luck getting them changed." (This is a very nice guy, by the way. He wasn't being obstinant, he was just telling me that it's not a straightforward matter to change something like that, and it might not be doable with a reasonable expenditure of resources.)

Anyway, I pressed him for something in writing to document the fact that the ordinances are unlawful, and he said he would see what he could come up with. A couple of weeks later, I got a letter from the New York Department of State (where he and the other attorney work), with a copy of a letter on State of New York letterhead from the second state attorney detailing explicitly that such ordinances are unlawful and citing a handbook of legal guidelines for municipalities for regulating mobile homes that also states explicitly that the ordinances are unlawful.

Armed with these documents, I began by calling the local codes enforcement officer, who likes my work and is very helpful, and he referred me to the attorney for several of the townships nearby. The attorney for the townships was doubtful that the ordinances were unlawful, but I simply told her, "There's no grey area here. The documentation is absolutely unequivocal, and you will have to change the laws." She gave me a list of the townships her firm represents and referred me to the town supervisors for each one.

I started with my own township, met with the supervisor (a very nice woman in her seventies who's extremely well organized and professional), gave her copies of the documentation and got on the agenda for the town council meeting, which was Tuesday three days ago.

The head attorney from the firm representing the township(s) was there, as was the codes enforcement officer. The meeting went well, and the council began the process of changing the law, which will take two months due to the requirement of a public reading of the proposed new ordinance at the next (monthly) meeting and then ratifying the new ordinance at the following month's meeting.

Then, Wednesday, I called the town supervisor for the next township west of here and got on the agenda for their meeting, which happened to be that evening. I handed out copies of the documentation and made my request that the law be changed.

Yesterday, I called the town supervisor for the next township east of here (an argumentative old codger, it turns out), got him to settle down and listen to what I was telling him, called his township's attorney (the lead attorney, whom I had met with Tuesday evening) to determine that the legal work wouldn't cost the township $1000 in legal fees as the supervisor had ranted ("less than $150," the attorney said, and they can use the same legal work that has already been done for the first township), called the codger back, and parted on friendly terms with the next steps planned for having that township's law changed.

Now, it's looking like it will be pretty easy to get every township within about a 50 mile radius of here to change their laws, based on the legal work already completed for my own township, which each successive township can just splice into their statutes without having to do any background work.

This is my first experience having to deal with local government, and I'm feeling seriously cheered by how it's going. They're changing the laws all up and down the map because I told them they have to! How cool is that?

Best wishes,
Jerry

[missy]

Jerry - GOOD FOR YOU!!!! I wish more people would take a more immediate interest in what goes on in their local government.

[Doug_Tipple]

Did anyone see the recently released movie, Friends With Money?

There's an amusing scene in which the angry neighbor invites her remodeling friend over to check out the new "view" from her window.....

M

Yes, I saw "Friends With Money" last weekend. Like the woman in the movie, I would be very upset if my neighbor built a second story to their house in a neighborhood of single-story homes, thus blocking my view of the horizon.

Actually, chiffers, I thought that this thread was going to be about another type of erection problem, and, instead of Viagra, I was about to recommend the suppliments arginine (3,000 miligrams a day) and ginkgo biloba (60 miligrams daily). However, I will postpone my comments for a more appropriate thread.

[Innocent Bystander]

Well done, Jerry. Your story is an object lesson. That's the way local government should be - listening to a rational voice.

[izzarina]

Here in Ireland if you want to erect a shed or add a house extension you have to draw up plans submit them to the local planning council then wait for their permission ,then there is a further waiting time to see if there will be any objection from neighbours.All in all it’s a very long drawn out process.
Is it the same in other parts of the world ???


RORY

Most places in New England (US) are like this as well. We lived in a tiny little town in New Hampshire, and you had to have a permit to put a new closet inside your house, and the opinions of the neighbors did have weight on silly issues like that. A lot of it also depended on how "popular" you were in the town. If you wanted to do something, like build a dog house, and your neighbor didn't want you to and he or she was "liked" by certain key members of the planning board (and you really weren't), then they would win the vote of the board. It was insane.

[talasiga]

In a lot of (if not all) rural parts of Australia it all depends on how big your erection is.

I have only been responsible for one erection that required permission.
That particular erection cost me over $8000. I still have it.

Its a great erection and it has no leaks.

[The Weekenders]

Even paint color can be regulated in New England towns.

[Innocent Bystander]

Even paint color can be regulated in New England towns.

Yes, we have that in "Listed Areas". There are three categories of listed building, category one being the highest. These are buildings which should be preserved, according to statute. Sometimes we have areas where there are a lot of listed buildings and yes, you can't paint your window frames dayglo orange. On Edinburgh's Princes Street, there is an ordinance insisting that the shop fascias (The big flat banner with the name on) should all be the same height at top and bottom. While I was there somebody buggered it up good and proper, but I can't remember who. It was one of the big names: MacDonalds or W.H.Smith. It might even have been James Thin (a big Bookseller in Scotland).

It's a little disturbing to note the frequency with which listed barns burst into flames in the Home Counties. It's almost as if someone wanted them gone....

[SteveShaw]

I saw the heading and came here for sex advice. Why can no-one ever stay on topic these days!