why and when to upgrade?

[Jennie]

Went to a session this weekend and, thanks to a very generous fellow fluter, had a chance to play a beautiful blackwood Olwell for a few tunes.

I was expecting some astonishing sound or feel. But as it turns out, I play much better on my Casey Burns flute, and sound better. Partly because it's more comfortable to hold. And I assume because I'm accustomed to that embouchure. It makes me happy that I'm so well bonded to the flute I have. But...

I'd been wondering how I could possibly decide which flute I'd want for an upgrade, and experiencing some anxiety over waiting lists. Now I'm thinking that there are probably years of good music in the flute I already have, and wonder if I'll ever attain the skill level that would make a switch beneficial.

At what point does one find the need for another instrument? Will I ever outgrow this one? How will I know?

Jennie

[bradhurley]

I think the only reason to "upgrade" is if you start feeling limited by your instrument -- i.e. that after a reasonable amount of time spent getting to know it, you can't produce the kind of sound that you want. A "reasonable amount of time" could be a few years if you're a beginner, less if you're more experienced and have a better idea of what kind of sound you're after.

I started on an old German flute and played it for nearly 10 years before I felt the need to upgrade to a flute that had more power and more importantly, more soul. Power and "loudness" are a lot less important to me than other aspects of a flute's character...I was looking for warmth and depth of tone, a certain complexity and edge that I just couldn't get with the German flute, and I did want the flute to have more power when I needed it.

[Denny]

You ask trick questions, no?

"At what point..." When you can almost get a sound you want, but it is too much work, you might want to think about an other flute.

"Will I ever..." Wrong question. The CB Folk is a great all wood flute. What it does it does very well. How would we know!

"How will I know" That's one of those zen "grasshopper" questions... You will know when you know.

...and what Brad said, while I was fussing around with this!

[chas]

I seemingly always feel the need for a new instrument. Initially I was getting different flutes to see what style I liked. Now I'm getting different keys. After that, hopefully I'll be sated.

I think the reason to get a new flute is that you want one. Don't listen to the people who say "You NEED a ____ if you want to play _____ music," or, "Yes, that's a good beginner's flute, but you need a big-kid flute now." The flute that's right for you is the one you enjoy playing.

[Whistlin'Dixie]

I was recently speaking with a fiddle player, and the subject of bows came up. (I guess fiddle bows can be pretty expensive) The person had tried many bows, then bought the one she liked to play the best. It was not the "most expensive" of the bows available, the bow selected was the one that was the most 'enjoyable' to play, giving the most pleasing sound to that particular player.

"After all, I am the one who has to listen to it all the time".
I thought that was a nice sentiment.



M

[BrendanB]

Jennie,

I certainly agree with what Brad said earlier, but another thing to keep in mind is that you will almost always sound better on the flute that you are used to playing. Recently, I was with a bunch of other flute players and we were doing the flute swap thing. Between the four of us we had a Rudall Rose, a Hamilton, a LeHart, and an Olwell. We were going through all the permutations of playing a set on the different flutes. What was interesting was that when we all went back to playing our own flutes, we all sounded better on them than any of the other flutes that we had just played, even though they are all lovely instruments. It's just that we knew the flutes better and we knew how to get what we wanted out of them.

This is sort of a round about way to answering your question. Having a more demanding flute may actually improve your tone over time. A flute that is less forgiving will require your embouchure to become more focused and improve. That doesn't mean that you should get rid of your current flute. All I'm suggesting is that your tone didn't change much when you played a couple of tunes on the Olwell because it was too short of a time to really get used to the flute. I would guess that if you were practicing regularly with it that over time your tone would improve.

Personally, I think that a good player will get a nice tone out of almost any flute and that buying a bunch of different flutes isn't all that useful. At the same time, playing a flute that requires you to improve is a good thing. It's sort of like working out and adding more weight. You can certainly stay fit lifting the same weight all the time, but if you add more you will get stronger.

[jim stone]

What matters isn't when you need one; it's when you
want one real bad.

[tin tin]

When the instrument you're playing limits your ability to express the music, then it's time to upgrade.
Thinking back on my classical flute days (playing Boehm flute), I played a student model for five years, then a more intermediate level flute for 8 years, and then a 'conservatory' model. Developing the tone and technique to max out a flute can be a slow process.

[Jennie]

Wise counsel, all of you. Okay, so I'm just going to have to accept the slower learning curve! Seems like, since I already know all the tunes and the fingering, the rest should just follow. If I can hear it, I should be able to play it, right?

So for now I'll keep working with what I have (which is pretty wonderful, after all). And think about keys sometime in the future, either retrofitted ones or something else.

Thanks all.

Jennie

[jim stone]

The trouble is that if you wait till your instrument actually
limits your abilities, to order a better flute, it will take well
over a year to get it. A year and a half is a long while to
have your abilities limited.

So the game is to estimate where you will be in a year and
a half. Order in advance what you don't yet need but probably will.
Also there is the risk that, in the interim, you will decide
that you don't want what you ordered--you ordered a Pratten
and you realize you really want a Rudall, say.

So it's prudent (hee! hee!) to now order very good flutes,
the best, in various varieties on the expectation that you
will need at least one of them by the time it reaches you.
One good thing about the best flutes is that you can
recover your money. If you can bring yourself
to sell em.

Flutes aren't money lost; just money in a different
form--at least very good ones.

FLOA speaks....

[daiv]

When the instrument you're playing limits your ability to express the music, then it's time to upgrade.
Thinking back on my classical flute days (playing Boehm flute), I played a student model for five years, then a more intermediate level flute for 8 years, and then a 'conservatory' model. Developing the tone and technique to max out a flute can be a slow process.

exactly. dont feel bad if you havent outgrown your flute yet, jennie. and dont worry if you never do. i dont have a conical yet, but i play boehm. mine isnt too expensive, only about $1,800 or something. but let me tell you, this past august, i tried out many flutes that were upwards to $5,500, and it wasn't until i got to a hand finished (or hand made, i cant remember) flute that a flute was better. there was one that was nice, that was $4,500, but it wasnt worth $2,000 more. now, for classical music, all the other flutes played cleaner and nicer in the 3rd octave. so yeah, if i was serious into classical, any other flute i had tried would do me better. but for irish, none of them had a strong lower octave except that hand*'ed $5,500, and the one that was $4,500. so basically, only one flute would have been worth my money for irish music, but somehow i cant see myself ever buying a silver flute in the next ten years. i know that when i get a chance to try out flutes in the 7-10,000 range, they will be amazing. but, for that price i can get the two concertinas i have on order, a Jon C. and a Copley.

interesting enough though, i tried an olwell at a session the night before i tried out all the expensive flutes, and it played clearer, and easier in the first and second octaves. i expected its bottom octave to be better, but not the second. it was like it played itself. technically, olwell is not a big name compared to any of the silver flutes i tried, but it played better, so "better" flute is relative.

what everyone else is saying is true as well, that you will always sound the best on your own flute, but you dont need to change until you want to.

i guess i got lucky and found a flute that fits me. it sounds like you have as well.

[chas]

Seems like, since I already know all the tunes and the fingering, the rest should just follow. If I can hear it, I should be able to play it, right?

ROTFLMAO!!! Oh, you're killin' me!

Seriously, if people were all able to play what they hear, with all the nuances, the world would have an awful lot more great flute players. If I were able, even once, to play The Fairy Queen the way Chris Norman plays it, I will have accomplished my greatest, or at least, most unrealistic goal in life, and God can strike me down right then and there.

The previous few posts have made some very good points. One reason I still have a few D flutes coming is that I ordered them some time ago. Oh, and that I want a flute in bocote, but other than that, the Olwell boxwood does me just fine.

[daiv]

The previous few posts have made some very good points. One reason I still have a few D flutes coming is that I ordered them some time ago.

its like perpetual christmas! i was thinking of ordering an olwell, and time it to come when my carroll concertina is ready in 3 years, but then if i stagger it more, it'll be more fun. plus two amazing instruments coming in at one time is a bit of an overkill.

[Jennie]

Seems like, since I already know all the tunes and the fingering, the rest should just follow. If I can hear it, I should be able to play it, right?

ROTFLMAO!!! Oh, you're killin' me!

Seriously, if people were all able to play what they hear, with all the nuances, the world would have an awful lot more great flute players. If I were able, even once, to play The Fairy Queen the way Chris Norman plays it, I will have accomplished my greatest, or at least, most unrealistic goal in life, and God can strike me down right then and there.

Yeah, I guess that came out sounding rather assuming. It's just that as a reasonably nimble-fingered whistle player who can learn the tunes quickly, why shouldn't I be an immediate success with flute? Just as I thought that since I got A's in college, I should be an instant master teacher once I hit the classroom. I'm a naive optimist. But I'm in this for the long haul, and I'll keep working at it.

Meanwhile I sure appreciate all the encouragement to acquire more flutes, beautiful and expensive ones. We all come here to support our habit, don't we? To be affirmed?

Hello, my name is Jennie, and I'm into Irish traditional music...

[dow]

Hello, my name is Jennie, and I'm into Irish traditional music...

Hi Jennie!