table manners

[Cynth]

....One of my deeply Southern friends from a classy family once complained about the fact that Yankees often switched their forks to their right hands after cutting, and before moving the food to their mouths. So be carefu, Cranl. The last thing you want to do is to look like a Yankee--even if your state was on the Union side.....

This alone should be reason enough to study up on manners I would think.

[GaryKelly]

By the way, I can attest that proper table etiquette is much more apparent in British homes than in American ones, so there is definitely a cultural aspect here - Gary, maybe that's why you're finding this thread a bit frustrating.

No, I simply made the mistake of believing Cranberry was genuinely seeking advice. Not a mistake I'll be making again.

[Jack]

By the way, I can attest that proper table etiquette is much more apparent in British homes than in American ones, so there is definitely a cultural aspect here - Gary, maybe that's why you're finding this thread a bit frustrating.

No, I simply made the mistake of believing Cranberry was genuinely seeking advice. Not a mistake I'll be making again.

I'm sorry. I wasn't seeking advice on table manners (especially from such a proper Brit ), just the "why?" of it because, to be honest, there being a "wrong" way to cut eggplant seems a little bit insane to me. *hugs*

[SteveShaw]

The goal is to maintain pleasant conversation with your dinner partners. To facilitate that end, we refrain from activities which detract rather than enhance it.

That's an interesting point of view. Do you recommend people eat before they go out to dinner? That would allow one to poke at their food in company, and spend more time on the niceties and conversation than on the excellent nosh. I go out to eat in order to eat. If I spend a hundred on a meal for myself, I expect the food to be excellent, and I intend to shovel as much of it down as I can stuff in. Your stance seems to be that going out for a meal should be more of a social occasion than a dining experience.

djm

I am with you 100% on this one, mate. When I go out to eat I'm not going to waste time pushing my ever-cooling food around politely with whatever is deemed by the fun police to be the correct utensils. I shall eat quickly and lustily, and anyone who does the same gets my appreciation. Anyone who doesn't gets their grub eaten by me. Don't talk with your mouth full. Don't masticate loudly and juicily. Try not to slop stuff around everywhere (I usually fail on this one). Don't take more than your share until you're sure it's spare. Don't sit there discussing the bloody food all night. These are the only rules that matter. All others are rather sad sh*t.

Steve

[djm]

Steve, we are on the same plane of enlightened gustatory excellence. Surely the sun shines out of our arses.

djm

[SteveShaw]

I said masticate.

Steve

[SteveShaw]

Steve, we are on the same plane of enlightened gustatory excellence. Surely the sun shines out of our arses.

djm

It sure feels that way when I've had a king prawn vindaloo the night before.

Steve

[djm]

Oh, geez, we LUVS a good curry. We're definitely on the same plane. Too bad about the man boobs - oops!

djm

[SteveShaw]

Oh, geez, we LUVS a good curry. We're definitely on the same plane. Too bad about the man boobs - oops!

djm

Just when I thought we were getting friendly!

Steve

[Cynth]

I am with you 100% on this one, mate. When I go out to eat I'm not going to waste time pushing my ever-cooling food around politely with whatever is deemed by the fun police to be the correct utensils. I shall eat quickly and lustily, and anyone who does the same gets my appreciation. Anyone who doesn't gets their grub eaten by me. Don't talk with your mouth full. Don't masticate loudly and juicily. Try not to slop stuff around everywhere (I usually fail on this one). Don't take more than your share until you're sure it's spare. Don't sit there discussing the bloody food all night. These are the only rules that matter. All others are rather sad sh*t.

Steve

I honestly don't think Lamby (or I) is pushing weird extremes of manners. The manners you mention here sound fine for most places. You are aware of not grossing out your companions. Some people might have somewhat different manners, but the main point is not to act like a pig. So it doesn't sound like you do. Eating quickly and lustily, well, I'd have to see that to see if it is the same as shoveling it in. But no one is advocating taking teeny bites and mincing about generally. There are situations in which probably the stranger rules might be relevant---but one can usually, as you and djm and I do, avoid going to those sorts of things. If I had to go to something fancy for a good cause, I would try to behave in a more lady-like way for the sake of the cause.

[Jack]

Dear Ann Landers,

I am extremely grossed out when someone with red hair, someone from Mississippiana, someone with a nose bigger than an egg, someone who eats cereal for dinner, or, worse yet, someone who is known to play recorder, sits down beside me to eat. Whatever shall I do?

Lovingly yours,
Table-manners Degerate

[Wombat]

Dear Ann Landers,

....... Whatever shall I do?

Lovingly yours,
Table-manners Degerate

You could start by learning to spell 'degenerate.'

[Jack]

Dear Ann Landers,

....... Whatever shall I do?

Lovingly yours,
Table-manners Degerate

You could start by learning to spell 'degenerate.'

But how will that help with those nasty recorder players?

[Wombat]

Dear Ann Landers,

....... Whatever shall I do?

Lovingly yours,
Table-manners Degerate

You could start by learning to spell 'degenerate.'

But how will that help with those nasty recorder players?

It won't. But you've got to start somewhere.

[Lambchop]

Cynth is correct. Neither of us are advocating extreme or "refined" behavior. We're both well within the realm of just plain decent table manners.

If you cannot separate a bite of food from the whole portion without sawing, pressing, scraping the whole thing back and forth, or otherwise exerting more than a minimum amount of force, then you need to use a knife.

If you are going to use a fork, you use the side of the tines. You do not stab the points in and twist. If you cannot cut the food with the side of the tines, it is too difficult to cut, so you use a knife. But, do not use a knife to cut anything which is able to be cut with a fork.

So, let's look at a scenario. You're having dinner with a nice family. They serve eggplant parmigiana. It's very good, and you like it, but the eggplant might have been a large, tough one, and the skin isn't exactly tender, so it's difficult to cut cleanly with the fork. You start sawing and scraping and hacking at it with your fork.

Your hostess is going to be mortified, because your sawing and scraping and chopping tells her that her dish isn't the best.

All you see in "manners" is that they are arbitrary, high-fallutin' ways of being snobbish, so you think it's just fine to saw and scrape. After all, you think people should think well of you no matter what your background and personal habits.

But it isn't about YOU at all. It's about YOUR HOSTESS and HER feelings.

Your sawing and hacking, whether you intended it or not, showed her that her meal was not as good as she would have wanted it to be. It showed her that the eggplant was too tough. You broadcast the fact to everyone with your overblown display of sawing and hacking. YOU COMPLAINED ABOUT THE FOOD. You didn't just use the wrong implement . . . you criticized your hostess.

And what happens when your sawing and hacking causes sauce to spill on her tablecloth? That's a stain that will never come out and it got there unnecessarily.

Now, it's expected that a dish might be a little too tough to cut with a fork, but if that is the case, you avoid broadcasting that fact to everyone--just use a more appropriate implement, the knife, to cut neat bites. You can use a knife to cut eggplant even if it is tender, so using a knife if it is tough isn't inappropriate at all. It's expected, in fact.

Manners are never about YOU. They're about other people and their feelings. Considerate people put the feelings and needs of others before their own. They cut their food with a knife, when necessary, and avoid making a spectacle that might embarrass others.

Actually, I am now wondering if you didn't just stab the whole thing and hoist it up to gnaw a piece off.