Do you think my flute has a crack??

[seisflutes]

Lately when I play, my flute feels all dull and icky and blah for about the first hour. After that it perks up. I was thinking perhaps there's a tiny crack that swells shut after an hour or so of playing. I've done the "cover everything and try to suck air through" thing, and found nothing that way, and none of the notes are affected in particular , so I'm by no means sure of my cracked theory. What do ya'll think? Thanks.

[eilam]

could also be a tenon that swells and tighten up?

[seisflutes]

Tenons have all been thickly greased without much if any change in the problem, and they don't feel loose. Tuning slide also checks out fine, and the cork is nice and tight. As far as I can tell, that is. *shrugs*

[peeplj]

This is flying blind, of course, but judging from your description, check the embouchure hole for a minute crack in side or the other.

Also if you have keys, you may have:

--a weak spring

--a pad that is no longer seating

--a key that is stuck

--a pad that is old and dry, still seating but not sealing at first

--a leak in the tuning slide

Good luck, and let us know what you find!

--James

[Jon C.]

Lately when I play, my flute feels all dull and icky and blah for about the first hour. After that it perks up. I was thinking perhaps there's a tiny crack that swells shut after an hour or so of playing. I've done the "cover everything and try to suck air through" thing, and found nothing that way, and none of the notes are affected in particular , so I'm by no means sure of my cracked theory. What do ya'll think? Thanks.

I hate to say this, but is it the flute, or the embouchure mushing out? I have that problem sometimes, all of a sudden the flute won't play, I think what happened to it? Then it comes to life, but my thinking is, that it is just me...

[Cathy Wilde]

Ewww, it sounds like something's leaking. I'd also check around the toneholes & the socket ends, particularly the ends of the barrel.

Sometimes it helps to shine a flashlight inside the flute whilst inside a dark closet, too -- that way you can see if there's any extra light escaping.

FWIW, I just Damien Stenson pour water into & out of his bamboo flute at a Teada show this weekend. I understand the temptation totally!

[chas]

Have you tried putting a little water on the suspect places (sockets, barrell), and, for each individual piece, covering the end and all the toneholes (harder to o with a Pratten), and blowing and listening whether any air escapes? It's really pretty easy and effective.

[seisflutes]

One symptom I completely forgot to mention. When it starts out all dull and blah, it's also really sharp. I have to pull the tuning slide out almost an inch. And when it perks up, it pretty suddenly goes back to normal pitch, like within the course of one set of tunes.

I have one key, and it seems to be fine.

I'll try the water thing.

And I'm just about sure it's the flute, and not me, 'cause my other flutes are playing the same way they always have.

[rama]

two things come to mind....
because the situation is alleviated overtime...
which key do you have? try sealing the tonehole under the key with a little tape or blu-tac or something other than the keypad. be positive that hole is sealed before you start playing. then see what happens. sometimes as moisture hits a pad a seal develops that might not have been there previously or somehow the pad gets reseated as you are playing.

because moving tuning slide seems to help correct the problem....
also be certain the hj is not leaking, notably a leaky tuning slide. rotate the outer slide over the inner sleeve 360 degrees and see if the two mate evenly and securely in all 360 degrees. check for the slightest wobble or sticky point or uneven feel. it does not take much to disrupt tone.
oh, one more...
inspect the embouchure hole, maybe clean it out with a q-tip, sometimes dried spit can get caught on the wall and build up.

[Cathy Wilde]

My Hamilton did that fairly regularly, especially in dry weather; it drove me crazy until I figured it out! It turned out that a pinkie-fingernail-sized chunk of wood had broken off the socket edge in the foot joint (you have to look inside the foot to see), which in turn caused two hairline stress cracks along the recess of the Eb key block and the edge of the Eb tonehole where the wood is really, really thin.

Until I can pony up for a new foot, I've done a "temporary" fix with beeswax (I ended up removing the key and plugging the tonehole, too) and it at least plays in tune now, though it's still somewhat leaky (but I didn't fine-tune the fix much, either)(and of course, one of the other keys could be leaking slightly, too).

I have no idea how or why this happened (apparently the previous owner had similar issues), or how or why the fix seems to work other than at least there's a wee bit better seal between the body and the foot.

Anyway, I hope that's not the case with yours. But it might be worth a look inside at the sockets nonetheless. Better take a flashlight; it's dark in there!

cat.

[Jennie]

Another leak-finding method, albeit a little gross, does make it easy to locate the offending area. But you need a friend who smokes...

I used to do this with my clarinet when I replaced pads. My dad smoked a pipe, and I was already used to his second-hand smoke. You can guess what to do. Have the smoker fill up their lungs, then cover end and holes, and blow into the embouchure. If there's a leak, you'll be able to see it.

Of course, then you'll have to have somebody blow air freshener into your instrument... ... though I never noticed a really long lasting smoke smell in my clarinet. It may be worth a try.

Jennie

[seisflutes]

My Hamilton did that fairly regularly, especially in dry weather; it drove me crazy until I figured it out! It turned out that a pinkie-fingernail-sized chunk of wood had broken off the socket edge in the foot joint (you have to look inside the foot to see), which in turn caused two hairline stress cracks along the recess of the Eb key block and the edge of the Eb tonehole where the wood is really, really thin.

Oh dear. That sounds sort of familiar, only it's my tenon(the one that fits into the head) that got a chunk broken off, not a socket. See my post from July: http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=31001
And the weather has been drier lately(my chanter reed has noticed!). Maybe it's gotten a stress crack in there. I did take a look under that chip and didn't see anything, but it was just under the rather dim lamp by the corner of the sesssions last Sunday. I'll look again with brighter light. I would think that all the greased thread over it would prevent any leaks there if there were a crack, but what do I know?

because moving tuning slide seems to help correct the problem....

It only helps correct the pitch, the dullness and icky blah-ness remain unaffected. I really have checked the tuning slide for problems, and it really seems to be okay.

[Cathy Wilde]

Eeee, I hate that! I don't know if I'd rely on the thread to completely seal a crack. That escaping air is pretty ingenious....

BUT beeswax (mixed with raw linseed or almond oil), on the other hand (hey, it's the flute player's duct tape! I bought a flute off ebay with a big crack in the foot that's been filled with beeswax, and it plays great. So I'm a believer!) ...

ANYWAY. Maybe if you take a fingerfull of beeswax and kind of smear it around inside the flute under the chip it'll fill in any little crevice that may be lurking. Then, if the flute improves you'll at least know what the problem is ....

Thanks for the post reference. I'll take a look at it and see if there's further help for the Hammy!

Best,
cat.

[fluti31415]

Eeee, I hate that! I don't know if I'd rely on the thread to completely seal a crack. That escaping air is pretty ingenious....

BUT beeswax (mixed with raw linseed or almond oil), on the other hand (hey, it's the flute player's duct tape! I bought a flute off ebay with a big crack in the foot that's been filled with beeswax, and it plays great. So I'm a believer!) ...

ANYWAY. Maybe if you take a fingerfull of beeswax and kind of smear it around inside the flute under the chip it'll fill in any little crevice that may be lurking. Then, if the flute improves you'll at least know what the problem is ....

Thanks for the post reference. I'll take a look at it and see if there's further help for the Hammy!

Best,
cat.

Cat, how do you fill in the crack, exactly? Do you have to open the crack up to get in between it? That just sounds scary.

I have an old Kohlert flute I got at an auction for $50 that has a crack in the body. It plays ok, for what it is, and the flute's probably not worth doing anything too elaborate to. But it would be nice to fix it -- at least I'd learn how.

Thanks in advance!

[Cathy Wilde]

Cat, how do you fill in the crack, exactly? Do you have to open the crack up to get in between it? That just sounds scary.

You're right, it does! I sure wouldn't open one -- I'm afraid if nothing else forcing the crack wider would only lengthen the split.

No, when I've done it I've merely taken my beeswax/oil block, broken off a small chunk and warmed it in my hands until it's workable (you could also heat it in a metal pie pan if you want it more liquid), and then gently smeared it into the crack until the crack was filled. The trick is, I think, to attack the crack from both inside AND outside the flute whenever possible.

(Which may be difficult when it's the body of the flute, but you might be able to angle the butt end of your cleaning stick in along it -- I once got ingenious with a chopstick and a shaved-down wine cork wrapped in fine grit paper/000 steel wool to clean up residue from super-glueing a foot crack)

Anyway, inside the flute you'd smooth the wax to follow the curvature & plane of the bore; outside you'd smooth it down 'til only the crack was filled. When the wax returns to room temperature you can gently scrape off the excess with your fingernail (or a wooden chopstick or popsicle stick or the end of your cleaning rod if inside the flute).

And then of course there's the superglue option, which works really well on stable, settled cracks. There are some good threads on that on this board, but here's the Reader's Digest version: Just get the runniest superglue you can find and "paint" the crack with successive layers of glue via a toothpick or paperclip. Then clean up with superfine steel wool and touch of acetone if necessary, and restore the finish with raw linseed oil and a soft cloth.

But again, I've had much better luck if I can also glue the crack from the inside as well -- it only makes sense that a crack is going to affect the curvature of the bore which WILL affect your sound, so to me the prime objective would seem to be restoring that curve without either trenches (cracks) or lumps (stray superglue/beeswax residue). (Hence the chopstick and wine cork contraption)

In either case, I highly recommend one of those goofy $5 hang-around-your-neck magnifiers from your local variety store's sewing or crafts department, though. Combined with good light, it sure helps these old eyeballs do a better job!

So take your time, and good luck! It's actually a lot of fun, especially when it works.

P.S. just had a thought: I bet one of those cork-grip (not the bulb kind, but the other) conductor's batons would be perfect for this kind of stuff! It's stiff but flexible enough; you could scrape and "tamp" wax with the pointed end and wrap the cork end with 000 steel wool to clean up superglue etc. from the bore ... and of course, conduct a medley of Sousa marches while you're waiting for the next layer of SuperGlue to dry. Cool! I'm off to the music store!