Session-related klutziness

[Redwolf]

I wonder if other people experience this?

I have a wide range of tunes now that I play reasonably well...jigs, reels, hornpipes, airs, all types. I can (and do) pick up a whistle in just about any time or place and roll off a tune or two without even thinking about it. Why is it, then, when I'm at a session (or really, any time I'm playing with or for other musicians), I become a total klutz, and can't play even tunes I've known for YEARS without making a fool of myself (even if the session is playing the tunes much more slowly than I normally do...for example, when I'm playing with our local slow/learners session). It's like all of a sudden I have 16 fingers and Swiss cheese for brains. I do practice playing with recordings, and with the "virtual session," so it's not just learning to accommodate other playing styles, speeds, etc. I'm beginning to think it's psychological!

Does anyone else out there have this problem?

Redwolf

[DCrom]

Yes.

Not that I do regular sessions much (having 2-week trips come out of the blue makes this kinda hard) but I have the same problem whenever I get together with other IrTrad musicians - I forget tunes I know well, or my fingers turn to thumbs. I may not be a great player yet, but most of the time I sound quite a bit better than I do at C & F parties

Call it "perfomance anxiety", I guess. The musician's answer to the hunter's "buck fever".

[Wanderer]

This happens to me too...tunes I play reasonably well at home I play like crap in public....same for recording. Doing the band thing on stage was a frightful mess the first few times.

I think it's just nerves

I have to know a tune really well at home in order to play it worth a damn in public. I've been playin for 10 years, and going to sessions for nearly 6...so it's not just a newbie problem

[Denny]

I'm beginning to think it's psychological!

Does anyone else out there have this problem?

Redwolf

Good guess!
Yes

I usually close my eyes...
helps focus on the sound, eh!

[scheky]

Once, in my misspent youth, I sang for a ska band.
When playing with the band at practice, everything went great. As soon as we played in front of a full audience, I tended to forget the words to everything we played.

I never managed to finish a set sober, which was very bad for my liver.

I can play the whistle just fine by myself (or in front of my wife and child). Add one more person into the room and I suddenly can't function with it.

It's likely not that you lack any skills, it's that you may be getting nervous (and just not realizing it). I wish I had something to say that would help you out...I've never managed to get over it myself though.

Of course, I don't really play just to play with others...I play because it's the only thing that makes those bad days good again (well that and the look of absolute joy in my son's face when I play).

[Cynth]

Well, of course it psychological. If you can play them at home but not in front of or with others as well, I don't think it could be anything else. I don't play at sessions but have experienced this in other situations. And I know I could never play music in front of anyone if I got to the point where it would be reasonable to try---if I even think about it I can't hit the notes. Performance anxiety, choking, lots of names for it, lots of people have the problem----many can't play in public at all for this reason. I bet there is a lot written about this and probably a lot of suggestions. There might be some sort of behavioral conditioning things you could do to desensitize yourself little by little. You definitely are not alone with this problem.

[Redwolf]

Well, it's nice to know I'm not alone!

It surprised me a little, when I first started playing in sessions, because I'm used to singing in choirs and to playing for the Morris Dancers, so I didn't think I'd be so subject to "nerves," so to speak. But I guess it makes sense....in a choir, I'm just one of the crowd (I don't do solos, so my voice doesn't stand out in any way), and as for the Morris Dancers, I've been doing it for so long, and it's so often the same tune over and over again in rehearsal (and the audience isn't interested in me anyway), that I just go into autopilot. Interestingly, I don't recall having such problems years ago when I used to busk in San Francisco, but I was a relatively young and cocky 20-something back then, and didn't even KNOW anyone else who was into Irish music, so I wasn't so worried about "getting it right". Perhaps it's a combination of being among other people who know and love the music and (often) having the loudest instrument in the session that makes me so self-conscious. Our sessions tend to be rather heavy on the mandolins (lovely instruments, but not loud).

Anyway, I'm glad to know it's not just me!

Redwolf

[slowair]

Hi Redwolf,

It's psychological alright.

I started playing four years ago and have been playing in seisiun for three, up to three nights a week.

I still have problems stumbling even on the easy ones sometimes. Remember, whistle is a melody instrument, so people are going to hear it. If you're playing on a high D, you're one octave above everyone else. So you already know you stand out.

I find the reason that I stumble is because of stray thoughts. If for even a half second I start to think of something else, whoosh, the tune is gone. I have to re-focus and find a place to join in.

Closing your eyes like someone suggested can help, but I feel kinda strange sitting there with my eyes closed. I've seen others do it and it seems too much like they have removed themselves.

What I do is a couple things. The first thing I do is find a speck of something on the floor. Then I stare at it while playing. The second thing, and I do it at the same time, is hear the tune in my head. Literally try to hear the music with your mind. The memory in my fingers will usually take over and it amazes me sometimes.

I still stumble. When I feel myself becoming anxious over it and it's my turn, I always call for tune that will center me. It's a tune I could play in the middle of a busy intersection if I had too. Usually it's Maggie in the Woods or Mairi's Wedding.

Just keep going though. I've been tempted to give up, but I've talked it over with other people in seisiun and they tell me they are screwing up all the time too. I just never notice them. And I guess they don't notice me screwing up either. They actually think I'm pretty good. I guess only I know better. Besides, this is suppose to be fun. I'd rather play with others over playing alone anytime.

Hope this helps.
Mike

[Cynth]

Interestingly, I don't recall having such problems years ago when I used to busk in San Francisco, but I was a relatively young and cocky 20-something back then, and didn't even KNOW anyone else who was into Irish music, so I wasn't so worried about "getting it right". Perhaps it's a combination of being among other people who know and love the music and (often) having the loudest instrument in the session that makes me so self-conscious.

I think the situation does have a lot to do with it. I could without trouble speak in front of a group of beginners in some field, but to speak of the same thing in front of people at my level or above would be very difficult. That is a good clue as to the source of the anxiety.

[Tony McGinley]

Its a case of the harder you TRY
to play well - the bigger the problem gets.
If I enter into the place where I am trying
to impress people, or afraid of making a
fool of myself, I am finished.

The solution for me is a matter of getting
mentally to the place where it doesn't matter
if I make a gaff, hit a bum note or get stuck.

I have done a small number of talk radio shows
and the thing only worked well when I was
able to talk and behave as if I was with a few
friends at home. Once I was able to hold that
mental state I was natural and able to recover
any gaffs I made etc.

I have found the same true of playing in public.

[Bret]

I've only been playing whistle for a couple years now and havn't been to (or able to find) a session in my area yet but I have been playing and touring with an english handbell ensemble for the last 5 years. I know that being part of a group helps the stage fright a lot but my part in this group is playing some of the highest notes and almost always playing the melody which can be very stressful, and was when I first started doing it. Over the years though I have become more confident and comfortable playing in front of a crowd and as a result I play better too. I hope that I will get the same result by performing whistle over and over as well. So I guess my suggestion for session klutziness is keep doing it and it will get better.

[Redwolf]

Its a case of the harder you TRY
to play well - the bigger the problem gets.
If I enter into the place where I am trying
to impress people, or afraid of making a
fool of myself, I am finished.

The solution for me is a matter of getting
mentally to the place where it doesn't matter
if I make a gaff, hit a bum note or get stuck.

I have done a small number of talk radio shows
and the thing only worked well when I was
able to talk and behave as if I was with a few
friends at home. Once I was able to hold that
mental state I was natural and able to recover
any gaffs I made etc.

I have found the same true of playing in public.

I can definitely relate to that! I know that sometimes I WAY overthink the tunes when I'm playing in a session. "Am I pushing this too fast? What's the next note? (always a recipe for disaster!) Have we done this part twice already? Am I too loud? (as if there were anything I could do about it! ) Am I tonguing too much (as if anyone else cares!)" It is improving though, albeit slowly. I do a lot better if I can just convince my brain to disengage and let my fingers do the work! It's definitely worth the effort...playing with others is what it's all about, I think, and when it clicks, it's more fun than a roller coaster!

One thing I've done that has helped quite a bit (thanks to a suggestion from someone else who plays in our sessions) is practice dropping in and out at odd places and for odd lengths of time (when I'm playing at home, that is). That way, if I flub when playing with others, I can jump right back in. Used to be I'd mess up, lose my place, and then have to wait until the beginning (or the beginning of the next part) came around again.

Redwolf

[colomon]

Actually, my guess is it isn't just psychological. Unless you're playing with great musicians who know your tune in great playing conditions, it is definitely harder to play with other musicians than it is to play by yourself or with a recording.

The reason is simple. Playing along with a recording is easy -- they're probably playing the tune perfectly. The session is an entirely different world. You start a tune: Fred jumps in with a slightly different version, Jack can't keep his rhythm steady, Sam is noodling somewhere in the general neighborhood of the tune, and Martha is playing chords which suggest she is deaf. Playing your tune under those conditions is radically harder than it is under the near ideal conditions you have at home.

The example is a bit extreme, but the general notion is true: it is just plain harder to play a tune at a session than it is at home, because there usually will be negative factors in the session, and playing with others naturally requires a greater precision on your part. Which is why, when we've talked here about how well you know a given tune, I've always reckoned "well enough to play in session" was a level or two of understanding beyond "well enough to play at home".

[anniemcu]

I wonder if other people experience this?

I have a wide range of tunes now that I play reasonably well...jigs, reels, hornpipes, airs, all types. I can (and do) pick up a whistle in just about any time or place and roll off a tune or two without even thinking about it. Why is it, then, when I'm at a session (or really, any time I'm playing with or for other musicians), I become a total klutz, and can't play even tunes I've known for YEARS without making a fool of myself (even if the session is playing the tunes much more slowly than I normally do...for example, when I'm playing with our local slow/learners session). It's like all of a sudden I have 16 fingers and Swiss cheese for brains. I do practice playing with recordings, and with the "virtual session," so it's not just learning to accommodate other playing styles, speeds, etc. I'm beginning to think it's psychological!

Does anyone else out there have this problem?

Redwolf

Oooooooooooh yeahhhhhhh!

It's some form of stage fright, I think. I've had it all my life.

Personally, I think it is a fear of what 'those who know' or 'those who think they know' will think of me and my efforts. I feel like such a charlatan at times, , thinking I can play anything worth others listening to or suffering through playing with... but they do seem to enjoy both, as I get asked back all the time. It does give me a great deal of empathy for new folk, though.

[michael_coleman]

It also doesn't help if you are leading the session and one of a handful of melody players. Because my breathing still needs some work on flute I find it hard playing it if I am one of a few players as I feel I have to carry the melody perfectly with great phrasing. Its a lot easier if there are others who can carry the melody as well, not as much pressure.