Bush: Intelligent Design Should Be Taught

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Tyler
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Post by Tyler »

jGilder wrote:
jbarter wrote:If the Earth is a product of intelligent design then where's the intelligence in putting mankind in there to mess it all up? :-?
Aliens planted humans on earth as an experiment. Image
They put us here for food and breeding fodder!! :twisted: :twisted:
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Post by jsluder »

Tyler Morris wrote:They put us here for food and breeding fodder!! :twisted: :twisted:
Or for hunting stock...

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leremarkable
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Post by leremarkable »

Intelligent Design?

First time I've heard of it.

In light of poverty, famine, child abuse, rape, genocide, not to mention imperial domination of the world by someone or other,

Intelligentdesign?

What the f@ck is intelligent about it?

Would seem to be more like survival of the baddest
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Post by Cynth »

You know, if a person couldn't get anywhere with the fossil record approach, I seriously think this would be another good argument to use against ID being taught in science class. I think it would be very hard for the proponents of this "theory" to answer these questions without refering to the very particular religious beliefs which are in fact behind the whole thing.
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Post by jGilder »

Cynth wrote:You know, if a person couldn't get anywhere with the fossil record approach, I seriously think this would be another good argument to use against ID being taught in science class. I think it would be very hard for the proponents of this "theory" to answer these questions without refering to the very particular religious beliefs which are in fact behind the whole thing.
I think you're right, Cynth. The question; where did we come from? is where science and religion diverge. The religious answer is intelligent design supported by speculation and belief. The scientific answer is evolution supported by evidence and fact. Religion isn’t supposed to be taught in public schools – so it shouldn’t be allowed.
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Post by Lorenzo »

I was reading about this book on The Panda's Thumb (a group weblog on evolutionary theory, the claims of the anti-evolution movement, and the defence of the integrity of both science and science education).

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Post by Walden »

It is truly amazing how bigoted people become, in the name of science.
Reasonable person
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Post by TomB »

Walden wrote:It is truly amazing how bigoted people become, in the name of science.

discuss
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Post by jbarter »

Walden wrote:It is truly amazing how bigoted people become, in the name of science.
I don't believe in science either. There's also a lot of difference between what I believe and what I'd like to believe.
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Post by fiddleronvermouth »

Walden wrote:It is truly amazing how bigoted people become, in the name of science.
What are you talking about? I'm lost. Are you saying that not wanting religion taught in science class is bigoted? Or what? I don't understand.
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Post by peeplj »

Walden wrote:It is truly amazing how bigoted people become, in the name of science.
This is doubtless true of any human endeavor.

However, that's not to say all endeavors are equal; they are not.

Be careful to avoid ad hominem--calling someone bigoted (even if they are) doesn't affect the degree of truth of the position they hold.

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Post by Walden »

fiddleronvermouth wrote:What are you talking about? I'm lost. Are you saying that not wanting religion taught in science class is bigoted? Or what? I don't understand.
Pushing anti-creation, or, if not anti-creation, anti-certain-interpretations-of-creation dogma, is pushing of a certain religious viewpoint, itself.
peeplj wrote: This is doubtless true of any human endeavor.
Yeah, but I'd expect more of science instructors.
peeplj wrote:However, that's not to say all endeavors are equal; they are not.

Be careful to avoid ad hominem--calling someone bigoted (even if they are) doesn't affect the degree of truth of the position they hold.
It was not ad hominem. I named no one.
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Post by Jack »

I agree with the gentleman from Oklahoma.

I always wanted to say that...
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Post by susnfx »

fiddleronvermouth wrote:
Walden wrote:It is truly amazing how bigoted people become, in the name of science.
What are you talking about? I'm lost. Are you saying that not wanting religion taught in science class is bigoted? Or what? I don't understand.
I hope Walden will forgive me if I take a little stab at this. Disclaimer: I am not (although I have been in the past) a Christian, I don't believe in God (although I'd like to), I also seriously question much of the theory of evolution.

In my opinion, science can teach it's current theories in science class. I don't think evolution should be taught as "fact." BUT, I would also like the teacher to say:
"There are people who believe otherwise about the creation of the Earth. They believe this: ... - oh, and by the way, this doesn't make them delusional or stupid or an elephant's *ss. Their beliefs are genuinely held and very sacred to them."
"There are also people who believe this: (insert any view of creation by any group of people here)....- oh, and by the way, this doesn't make them delusional or stupid or an elephant's *ss. Their beliefs are genuinely held and very sacred to them."

In threads in the past and in the current thread, I see not so much blatant statements that those who believe in or want different views of creation taught along with evolution are stupid, but jokes, sarcastic comments, snide remarks, an overall feeling that their intelligence/mental capacity is in question. Bloo made a very nice post about this somewhere (and I can't find it now).

I would ask, and I'm thinking Walden would ask (please forgive me if I'm being presumptious, Walden), that some degree of respect be shown for someone who believes differently than you do. You yourself might hold some beliefs--possibly some phobias--that others would scorn.

Susan
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Post by fiddleronvermouth »

Walden wrote:
fiddleronvermouth wrote:What are you talking about? I'm lost. Are you saying that not wanting religion taught in science class is bigoted? Or what? I don't understand.
Pushing anti-creation, or, if not anti-creation, anti-certain-interpretations-of-creation dogma, is pushing of a certain religious viewpoint, itself.
I'm not sure you're getting the point most of us have been trying to make, which is that science class should be about science, not religion. I don't feel I'm "pushing" anything, except that if I were to send my (hypothetical) kids to a class called "science", I would expect something resembling "science" would be taught there. Is that so unreasonable?

Likewise, if I sent them to Sunday school, I would expect them to be studying the teachings of Christ, as opposed to, say, Einstein's theory of relativity, or the periodic table of the elements.

It's unfathomable to me that anyone's feelings could be hurt by my "bigoted" insistence that teaching religion in science class would make it less of a science class and more of a religion class.
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