Can I get an honest opinion?

chas · Post by **chas** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 6:05 pm

On 2002-04-02 18:01, TelegramSam wrote:

That's the stupid website that was making me depressed in the first place. That guy goes on and on and makes it sound like unless you were born in Ireland, have massive musical talent, have never played or listened to any other kind of music, and are completely obsessed you're doomed to suck forever.

To paraphrase either Ford or Edison: Don't listen to people who say you can't do this or you must do that -- if Michelangelo had listened to these people he would have painted the floor of the Sistene Chapel and it would have worn away long ago.

Different people like different things. The whistle, believe it or not, can fit into many different types of music. The Simpsons prominently featured the flageolet this past week when they went to Brazil. It fits into lots of Carribean and African music. The Corrs aren't exactly traditional (and they had the advantage of growing up in Ireland).

I play because I like it. I'm not that good after a few years, but I enjoy it. It relaxes me in traffic, and despite my protestations, my wife and baby think I'm pretty good. (I'm not so sure about the cats.)

So if you enjoy the whistle, play it, and play whatever you want.

Charlie

Byll · Post by **Byll** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 6:39 pm

TelegramSam: There is some excellent advice in the posts I have read. I find that no matter what the instrument being learned, if one gives it a chance, the person develops a style of their own, in time. At first this style is a combination of the styles of many others, but slowly and surely the style coalesces into one's own. It is not necessary to continually strive to sound like the great players. They don't even sound like each other. Set small goals, attain them, and go on. My bass player has a law. It is called Muench's Law, and is applied to our accepting playing jobs. Simply stated, the law reads: If in the end, it is not fun, we don't do it. I hope the worry concerning what you are having trouble accomplishing goes out of your playing, and you simply allow yourself to enjoy this unique instrument, with or without ornaments and all the other 'stuff' of whistledom. Life is too short...
Cheers.
Byll

TonyHiggins · Post by **TonyHiggins** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 6:45 pm

If, on the other hand, you want to play jigs and reels, get McCullough's 121 Favorite Irish Session Tunes- book and cd's. Put the cd into the computer with slow down software and play along while reading notes in book. If that doesn't work, well...you could take up recorder or bodhran.

Seriously, that's what I would recommend in my expert opinion. Good luck,
Tony

susnfx · Post by **susnfx** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 6:54 pm

I know what you mean about Bro. Steve - I was so depressed after spending some time on that site. However, there are other great sites that have lots of music clips, tutorials, sheet music (if you read music). Try a few of these sites and see if you don't find some help - I did:
http://www.whistletutor.com
http://www.sessioneer.com
http://www.tinwhistler.com
http://www.frii.com/~ktcrumb/tunes/index
http://www.fingertrip.net/whistle
And if that's not enough, there are links on those sites, too, so you can get completely lost but have a good time doing it! I'm a complete beginner and have immersed myself in these sites and learned a lot.
Susan

dd · Post by dd » Tue Apr 02, 2002 7:24 pm

I am new too Sam. And I dont have anyone to play traditional music with...and until I get better I probably wont be playing the whistle much at the other music circles either. BUT what I am finding I really enjoy is playing along with a few of my cds that have whistle friendly songs. Some of these are mostly irish music but some of them are just folk music, and some are bluegrass. None of them are specifically whistle cds (I am looking at purchase options for some of those). The only real trick for me at this point is to find music in the right key as I only have a d whistle and as a beginer I am only really comfortable playing it in d g or em. Some of the folk stuff is great for whistle and has lovely simple tunes that are really good practice. The jigs are usually still too fast for me, although I finally (after practicing it SLOW for a week) could almost keep up on a jig. The waltz stuff and airs I am doing better with. I can play along now with two whole cds. If it is a tune I am not familiar with it helps if I keep playing the recording until I have the tune in my head. Even with the music in front of me I cant make it sound right until I can hear it in my head. I wasnt getting too far with the whistle.....until one day i realized I was humming one of the irish tunes from a cd....the sally garden. I went and picked up the whistle put the cd in.....and played it along with the cd. It was like a whistle break through lol. Good luck.

IrishBen · Post by **IrishBen** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 7:49 pm

Sam:
No doubt you've got a lot of things working against you. I think music to some extent , particulerly after a year or so should be kind of effortless. it could be that you are playing the wrong instrument, type of music or just don't have it in you to be a musician. I don't say this as a put down, some people just have abilities that take other directions. I've played with a number of people down thru the years that just don't have that certain something that lets others connect musically.Also for Irish Music it's nice to have others to play with, but the music can also be played solo. If you find it fustrating and not fun I would look else where for a hobby.
Ben

IrishBen · Post by **IrishBen** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 7:49 pm

Sam:
No doubt you've got a lot of things working against you. I think music to some extent , particulerly after a year or so should be kind of effortless. it could be that you are playing the wrong instrument, type of music or just don't have it in you to be a musician. I don't say this as a put down, some people just have abilities that take other directions. I've played with a number of people down thru the years that just don't have that certain something that lets others connect musically.Also for Irish Music it's nice to have others to play with, but the music can also be played solo. If you find it fustrating and not fun I would look else where for a hobby.
Ben

StevieJ · Post by **StevieJ** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:04 pm

On 2002-04-02 18:01, TelegramSam wrote:
That's the stupid website that was making me depressed in the first place. That guy goes on and on and makes it sound like unless you were born in Ireland, have massive musical talent, have never played or listened to any other kind of music, and are completely obsessed you're doomed to suck forever. Blah. I think I'm going to avoid that page for the rest of eternity....

Hey Sam,

Brother Steve here. Sorry to depress you! Sounds like you got stuck on the "meditations" page. It's not supposed to be depressing, though, it's supposed to be funny! Or at least, to get across some home truths in a funny way.

Why don't you try the practical pages instead? Theory is just theory, after all.

To answer some of the points you made, nowhere in my site do I say anything about having to be born in Ireland. (BTW I have met plenty of musicians who were born in Ireland and who suck and are doomed to suck forever.)

Nor do I say you have to not have listened to any other kind of music. I just say that if you haven't grown up with this kind, you really have to listen to it seriously as you learn. That, I'm afraid, is a fact.

Becoming obsessed does help. That's also a fact, but I may be exaggerating there.

As for talent, well that helps too, but talent is only 10% of genius according to Einstein (was it?). The rest, he said, is hard work.

Anyway, it's interesting to get your feedback. I'm really surprised that anyone should react to what I have written in the way you did, so I'll have to mull it all over for a while to see whether I should change a few things.

Steve

AnnaDMartinez · Post by **AnnaDMartinez** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:05 pm

TelegramSam, no matter what you do, half of the folks are gonna tell you you shouldn't do it and the rest are gonna tell you you're doing it wrong. Just a fact of life, kiddo, follow your heart! (Hugger)

_________________
Let it shine! Anna "Dances with Weasels" Martinez

[ This Message was edited by: Anna Martinez on 2002-04-02 21:07 ]

jackorion · Post by **jackorion** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:15 pm

I don't think it's a bad idea to put an instrument aside for awhile. Never say never though ya know? Your not giving up the whistle, "just taking a break" kind of thing.

A nice thing about playing a number of instruments, is being able to break from one for a bit. I have always come back a little rusty but overall a better player. A couple days of practice and I'm beyond where I left off. It's kind of wierd but it happens for me.

I'll recomend practicing with your voice. It's the easiest of all instruments, even if it does sound bad. Try to scat and/or lilt. This will help to get the feel of the music into your bones.

Hope this helps.

Oh yeah, most important thing, don't give up!!

chas · Post by **chas** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 9:30 pm

On 2002-04-02 21:04, StevieJ wrote:

Becoming obsessed does help. That's also a fact, but I may be exaggerating there.

It's absolutely a fact, but also a good way to get an ulcer or to have a heart attack.

As for talent, well that helps too, but talent is only 10% of genius according to Einstein (was it?). The rest, he said, is hard work.

Hey, I KNOW that was Edison (see earlier post in this thread)! "Genius is 10% inspiration and 90% perspiration."

Charlie

thomlarson · Post by **thomlarson** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 9:46 pm

I'm pretty sure that it was Dale Wisely that said it:

"Windway problems are 90% condensation and 10% salivation"</IL

Glengary · Post by **Glengary** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 11:05 pm

Somebody on C&F once suggested to take only 10 minutes a day to practice the whistle. That works for me. I'm very busy in my life and work and am spread too thin at times. However, 10 minutes a day keeps the repetition up and the fatigue down. I will play slowly but will keep the timing right. As I learn more, my speed picks up and I still try to keep my timing straight. Slow airs and jigs pretty much.
(As an edit, I thought I'd add that I'm learning on my own too.)
For inspiration, there's nothing for me like Joanie Madden. For variety, I'll switch off to the low D (which really gives me an appreciation of the soprano D)!
As one who sails, I'd offer the following:
the experience is in the journey - not the destination! Enjoy & have fun with it.

[ This Message was edited by: Glengary on 2002-04-03 00:08 ]

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Wed Apr 03, 2002 6:08 am

Don't give up!! Even if you never play with anyone else, the satisfaction you can have from playing any musical instrument is simply fantastic. I play by myself the vast majority of the time, and count this as some of the best spent time I have. When you can play several tunes fairly well, go to some public park and start playing. You'll see how much other people enjoy it, and you might even attract other Irish musicians, or get some new people interested. Do it!

Bagfed · Post by **Bagfed** » Wed Apr 03, 2002 7:00 am

The trick is to find something to motivate you and to like what you are playing. I want to be good enough to play in church someday.(As audience-phobic as I am, that is a major accomplishment) As long as I am making advances, no matter how slow or infrequent, I know I will get there. A song that has really helped me to learn is "Inisheer" I love the sound of it, it's nice and slow, you can learn it streight up then add ornamentation to it. There are are several recordings around on different sites with different ornamentations. You have to love the songs you are learning because you have to play them about 157 times to master them.

Aaron