An open letter to Loren.

Nelson · Post by **Nelson** » Sat Oct 23, 2004 12:01 am

Hi Loren, this morning I drove over to Johnny Gallagher's shop in Elkins, WV. A short distance but as long a drive as were I in a Rt. 128 traffic jam. Slow going through the fog, but when I came out on top of the cloud, the oak and maple and walnut and sassafras trees on the mountain tips stuck out like there was a monster flower pot under the clouds. I just drove with my knees and started playing on my flute, "The Autumn leaves..." That didn't last long with 16 ton coal trucks crowding the road and going in and out of the clouds.

Anyway when I got to Johnny Galliger's shop, he had 5 pieces of gun drilled cocobolo in a chicken-egg incubator with some similar black wood pieces. I thought he was trying to hatch little flutes but no, he was drying them. He said that when he drilled the cocobolo it was waxy inside. He's going to make an 8 key. It is an R&R. He went to Baltimore and spent a day at Chris Norman's house and measured the one that Chris uses on most of his tours. I think it is an 1838 make. The stuff has a distant smell. Johnny says that if he puts crazy (or super) glue on it, it would be ok allergy wise. He also showed me some silver tubes that he makes and draws himself. He cold draws them through a geared contraption--amazing. And then he makes another that just perfectly fits over it, I mean perfectly--absolutely amazing to me, it has to be a .0001 inch diameter accuracy.

So I know he will have no trouble making a silver plate around the embouchure. The last time I asked people about the allergy problem, every one said that super glue anoune the embouchue would take care of any allergy problems. A silver plate does not do the looks any harm and I was thinking about allergicated people feeling much more comfortable playing it with the plate, right? Question, if you were doing this would you screw it down with 4 wee screws or would you epoxy it on. He is going to not completely line the head. The wall there is about 5 mm, I know, because the chimney of the embouchure is always about that high in old wooden and modern silver flutes. 5 mm ought to be enough for some threads to grab, right?

What would you do? To plate or not to plate, that is the question. And then, to glue or screw?

Anyone else have suggestions, please chime in.
Thanks for listening,
Nelson

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Sat Oct 23, 2004 7:27 am

Nelson - I am aware I'm not Loren, but I had a similar allergy problem. I was allergic to the nickel silver that covered the headjoint of an antique german flute I used to own (the nickel silver covered the entire wooden head joint on this flute). For what it's worth, I used 3 coats of clear nail polish around the the lower part of the embouchure hole where my chin and lip touched the nickel silver and I had no problems (and it was easy to clean off when I sold the flute).

I'm sure superglue would work wonders, too, but I like the look of the silver band (even if I personally would have been much better off with sterling silver or no band at all).

Eric

Jack Bradshaw · Post by **Jack Bradshaw** » Sat Oct 23, 2004 8:44 am

Silver is notorious for ungluing...one of the worst bonders.....if you feel you have to resort to that approach I'll volenteer to sputter silver to chrome on the backside of your silver piece for you...that will improve the adhesion immensley
(actually so will using an alloy instead of pure silver...but I don't know what's best that way)

Jack (out of the country for the next week)

glauber · Post by **glauber** » Sat Oct 23, 2004 10:14 am

Nelson wrote:Anyway when I got to Johnny Galliger's shop, he had 5 pieces of gun drilled cocobolo in a chicken-egg incubator

That sounds so country to me!

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 1:17 pm

Nelson,

If I'm understanding your question right, then my answer would be that no screws should be used. Typically a lip plate is either bonded on top of the wood (if you are looking for increased chimney height, a la Boehm style), or inset to be flush with the surrounding wood (more "trad" style), either way, no screws required.

As has been already mentioned, you might want to be certain you aren't allergic to whatever metal is being used for the lip plate before you have one installed.

Super glue seems to work well for most people also, and when done properly it's nearly invisible from any significant distance.

Loren

Jon C. · Post by **Jon C.** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 1:40 pm

Fun fact:

The original lip plates were glued on by by melting shellac flakes (early hot melt) the dark shellac hid any imperfections in the recessed plate.
Jon

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 1:55 pm

Yes, and now we simply use Otter snot.

Loren

Jon C. · Post by **Jon C.** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:02 pm

Lots of that in Boston!

eilam · Post by **eilam** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:18 pm

right Jon, many makers still use Shellac, because it's easy to unglue by applying heat.
and clean up with alcohol (which all makers have in abundance around the shop)

dcopley · Post by **dcopley** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 7:12 am

eilam wrote: ......... and clean up with alcohol (which all makers have in abundance around the shop)

I'll drink to that.

Dave Copley
Loveland, Ohio

MarkB · Post by **MarkB** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 7:42 am

Dave, you could get a shellacing if your significant other reads your posting

MarkB

Nelson · Post by **Nelson** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 9:17 am

Thanks Loran and everybody else. Your info makes my decesion easy to make. I'll go with a plate and shalac. I really appreciate it because cocobolo is such a nice wood. It is the choice for pool ques, they say (but I have never seen pools line up for anything) but I want it because it is so oily.

I did not understand about the otter snot, either, but it makes no difference, I'm going with (not nickle*) silver and shalac. I did not understand about the otter snot because, on the Tygart River going from Elkins WV north toward Pittsburg, the Tygert fills the Tygart Lake of an old TVA dam there. There are a lot of otter there. I used to lay my clothes out on a big bolder for a few days to let the sun take the oder out, swim in the lake to deoderize me, dress and then sneek up on otters and watch them for hours. They are always in the water and if they had runny noses, I did not see any otter snot. So I for one would not be able to get any even it I prefered it over shalac.
____________________
I'm not using nickle espacially because Jayhawk and I are going to trade flutes for a few days and he is the one who alerted me to nickle silver.

eilam · Post by **eilam** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 10:04 am

Nelson - Otters are known to be extremely shy about their snot, seeing Otter snot will bring luck, and is considered more rare than seeing the tooth fairy!(I personally prefer the tooth fairy),
and that's the honest truth.

bradhurley · Post by **bradhurley** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 10:57 am

eilam wrote:
and that's the honest truth.

No it'snot

eilam · Post by **eilam** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 12:36 pm

tooth fairy snot ,
toothfully

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An open letter to Loren.

An open letter to Loren.

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Otter snot