Pure Sound and Sweet Sound

[SirNick]

Sweet; is what you get when you have remembered to clean your mouthpiece after a long Guiness laden session and you pick up your whistle to play the next morning

Rich; is when you did not clean your mouthpiece

Pure; when you have a good whistle and play it well regardless of your fipples cleanliness

[IDAwHOa]

Different people interpret these terms in different ways, but there are a couple of interpretations that are frequently used.

Pure, meaning #1: Making only musical tones; without chiff or wind sounds.

Pure, meaning #2: Having a more "flutey," or simple timbre, as opposed to a more "reedy," "husky" or "complex" timbre. In this version of purity, the whistle would probably also have to have less wind sounds or chiff, as well. (I say this in full knowledge that there are flutes that sound husky, reedy, "earthy," "dark," "woody," etc. that would not fit the definition of flutey as it's meant here. In fact, a whistle I would call "pure" would usually be purer sounding than most flutes by this definition. The term is just to give an indication.)

Meaning #2 may indicate that the whistle produces fewer audible complex overtones, though even a "pure" sounding whistle will be complex compared to a simple sine wave sound.

"Sweet" may be harder to define. To my ear, pure definition #2 usually sounds sweet, although there are cases where it may sound strident or piercing, which I wouldn't consider sweet. Since a whistle can be "pure" sounding according to definition #1 even if it has a husky or reedy timbre, a pure whistle by definition #1 may or may not sound sweet.

Best wishes,
Jerry

Hi, this is Mrs. NorCal

I really like the way you explained this. It fits my feelings almost to a T. I just was not able to figure out a way to express it.

[glauber]

Hey Glauber!

I'm just a beginner, but my Dixon high D (non tuneable) gets harsh (to me it simply sounds unstable, wanting to move in all directiosn) once I hit the G note in the second octave. It sounds like this happens on many whistles from what you mentioned (unless I misunderstood). If this is so, how would I find a good whistle to learn on that is more consistent, with not such a huge jump? Is this a benefit of using a tweaked whistle?

I sent you a PM (personal message).

[Darwin]

To me, "pure" implies not departing far from a strong fundamental tone (or whatever the correct terminology would be) for each note. That is, the purest note would be like that produced by a good tuning fork--no overtones and no white noise.

"Sweet", on the other hand, seems very subjective. I have only two whistles that i would characterize as sweet. One is the Feadog-Whitecap and the other is the Burke aluminum narrow-bore D (but not the Burke brass wide-bore C). The sounds of both are also relatively pure, so that seems to be an element in my definition of "sweet". The Burke is sweeter in the upper octave than in the lower.

"Harsh" has been contrasted with "sweet" here. To me, "harsh" could imply lots of white noise, like my pre-Whitecap Feadog, or the inclusion of odd overtones that are a little off from what one would expect of normal harmonics. So, in addition to low white noise, "sweet" implies a strong fundamental and clean harmonics.

Having said all that, I'll backtrack and say that, for me, "sweet" also seems to involve a bit of a quaver or vibrato, which might imply a slightly less than perfect set of harmonics.

But that's just me.

[Redwolf]

Using the definitions Redwolf has given here ...

If a complex/reedy voiced whistle sounds pleasing, it might be called "rich," "reedy" or "woody." If it sounds harsh, it might be called "raspy" or "edgy."

If a pure voiced whistle sounds pleasing, it might be called "sweet." If it sounds harsh, it might be called "strident."

Again, these terms can't be matched up 100%. For example, a complex voiced whistle might be strident, too.

Best wishes,
Jerry

Yep...that would square with how I tend to hear things.

Redwolf

[AngeloMeola]

I think "sweet" is a situation where the harmonics are in balance. My Hoover whitecap is a whistle I would define as "sweet". One time I played it into a tuner program that showed the harmonics on a graph. You could draw a straight line through the peaks out to at least the fifth harmonic. Each peak declined in a linear manner.

Harshness, on the other hand, would have a peak out of line with the rest.

Angelo

[KCJiang]

For all you, thanks for your valuable explanations. I start to understand the "pure sound" means and realize it is difficult to define "sweet sound". I think the a whistle can have "pure sound" but may not have "sweet sound". A "sweet sound" whistle should have "pure sound". Am I right?

By the way, if you can only keep one "sweet sound" whistle, which whistle you would like to keep.

[IDAwHOa]

Out of all our current High D whistles (Bleazey, O'Riordan, Weston, Overton, Hoover Redwood, Alba, Syn Aluminum, Syn Lancewood, Thin Weasel and Lon Dubh) my wife, the all hearing sweet whistle detector tells me that the Weston Sapele is the sweetest sounding of them with the Thin Weasel a close second.

What makes it sweet sounding to her? Very little air noise, very clean sounding. Not piercing or harsh in tone. (I think she means the harmonics are balanced and not complex). It sings to her. She says my Bleazey Low D sounds the same way to her. She says she has not heard a metal whistle that sounds sweet to her. She also says she will not allow me to part with either of these two whistles.

[Ridseard]

I think of "pure" as the sound generated by a perfect sine wave. It has absolutely no character. Harmonic overtones are what give instrument sounds their character, and in my opinion, "sweet" sounds have fairly prominent even-numbered overtones but somewhat subdued odd-numbered overtones. When comparing woodwind timbres, I think of "sweet" as sort of the opposite of "reedy."

[PhilO]

KC - I really don't think sweet necessarily = pure, and would cite my Abells by example. They have overtones and chiff, yet are sweet.

Regards,

Philo