GHBs at Irish cultural events

[Calum]

My guess is that the pastoral pipe was an invention, not an evolution of some other design. The notion of the double octave reed was common in classical music, and that along with the fact that it was designed from the outset to be chromatic, makes me suspect that it was invented by a maker or musician with a knowledge of classical music, rather than by the native traditional pipers. Certainly all the eraly literature I've seen on pastoral pipes seems tailored at the gentry.

Cheers,
Calum

PS As for GHBers in the post-45, it seems that any lying low did not last very long. John Gibson's Traditional Gaelic Bagpiping [ISBN 0-7735-2134-8, McGill-Queen's University Press, 1998], besides having possibly the most nerdy book title ever, turns over this issue in some detail.

[billh]

My understanding of the state of pastoral pipes is that there may be one extent set left in unplayable condition, and various bits in pieces unassembled in various museums. ...
djm

Inneresting then, since I've seen two complete sets in playable condition (in private hands). Without having gone on a quest to find them...

I suspect your impression could do with some recalibration. And I've seen a couple of complete sets in museums too.

[billh]

... the simple fact is the pastoral pipes are exactly the same as the earliest uillean or union pipes. I mean exactly. There's no extrapolation or leap of innovation required. You just yank off the foot joint, forget about low G, play the chanter like a tin whistle on the knee and you have union pipes. Obviously the chanter had to be retweaked to make bottom A (D I guess we'd call it now) come out the bell in exact tune, and hole tweaking in actual production models that followed to get the extreme lowerhand to tune perfectly, ...Royce

I used to believe this too, but the difference between some early union pipe examples and pastoral sets of nearly the same time period (c 1770-1780) is just too big. If you take the foot joint off of one of these Pastoral sets you get something _suggestive_ of a union pipe chanter, but way too brash and loud sounding. Or so I am told by owners of said beasts who have had lots of experience with early Union pipes as well.

More likely, one of two of the early "union pipes" is really a Pastoral that's missing its foot joint, which might explain why those specific early sets are so much different in character from the later lineage of uncontestedly "union" sets.

I am not denying the probably evolutionary nature of the change, but I now doubt sincerely that there was ever a hybrid instrument that behaved satisfactorily both with -and-without the foot joint.

[djm]

I suspect your impression could do with some recalibration. And I've seen a couple of complete sets in museums too.

This may have changed since I first read it. That web site is no longer available.

I'm starting to lean more towards Anthony Baines' Bagpipes, and go with the idea that the pastoral pipes were a later take-off from UPs.

djm

[oleorezinator]

hey tommy, this topic turned out ok in spite of all the pipe band dribble. ya just never know which way these things will turn. nice posts.

[AaronMalcomb]

Did somebody say pipe band?



Cheers,
Aaron

[mukade]

Did somebody say pipe band?



Cheers,
Aaron

Those men are wearing skirts!!

...and white knee socks!

Mukade

[AaronMalcomb]

Those men are wearing skirts!!

...and white knee socks!

Not so, there are women in the photo too.

You're from Japan, right?



Cheers,
Aaron

[mukade]

Those men are wearing skirts!!

...and white knee socks!

Not so, there are women in the photo too.

You're from Japan, right?

er...no

[Douglas]

I actually wear both of those (Kilt and Hakama). Kilt is of my family clan (McNiel). I have a grandfather, not Japanese (Nipponese) living in Japan. He served in WW II in Patton's 3rd Army.

That is a large pipe band Aaron.

[mukade]

Did somebody say pipe band?



Cheers,
Aaron

Those men are wearing skirts!!

...and white knee socks!

Mukade

Only joshing Aaron.

I wore both a Japanese hakama and a kilt at my wedding...althogh not at the same time

BTW I'm not Japanese; search through my previous posts and you'll see.

Mukade

[Uilliam]

Aaron.is the tartan of your band MacDonnell of Keppoch?.
Uilliam

[Dionys]

I wear Hakama and Keikogi for Kendo. They're surprisingly comfortable and make you look quite intimidating.

Dionys

[Royce]

The only reason the pastoral pipes didn't last is probably the already existing one-octave pipe tunes/pipe players/piping traditions that had religious significance almost in Scotland and the UK already.

That and they were apparently notoriously difficult to get going correctly. You think we modern uilleann players have it bad. They were apparently pretty pressure sensitive and because there was no need to stop the chanter on the knee to jump octaves, squeaky unintended octave jumps were a bit of a problem.

It's probably more a case where you could get the high B (From an A base as in Scottish systems) or the uilleann high E, maybe a note or two above the octave pretty reliably in a tune. I don't think most early border/lowland/Northumberland tunes for instance needed either a low lead note or any or many notes above the tonic.


Royce

[AaronMalcomb]

Aaron.is the tartan of your band MacDonnell of Keppoch?.
Uilliam

It is Ancient Fraser.

Only joshing Aaron.

I wore both a Japanese hakama and a kilt at my wedding...althogh not at the same time

BTW I'm not Japanese; search through my previous posts and you'll see.

I figured you were... kidding I mean. I was too. I believe that you're not Japanese.

Cheers,
Aaron