Moral Support Needed

caitlin ruadh · Post by **caitlin ruadh** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 1:19 pm

I've played the flute for 30 years, Irish and Scottish music for the last 7 or so. For various reasons, I play a french-keyed Boehm flute. I'm not very good at ornamentation--despite hours of practicing, it just never sounds "right," and my fingers often just don't move fast enough--so I tend to play with minimal ornaments, focussing on the energy of the tune.

Theoretically, none of this is a problem. Plenty of great Irish players use silver flutes (Joannie Madden comes to mind). And it seems to me that the incredible emphasis on loads of ornamentation and technical acumen is a fairly recent thing; listening to older recordings, there isn't so much of it. But I've continually run into this...attitude in other players I've known, that my choice of instrument and style of playing aren't "authentic" enough. I used to play out quite a bit, but I've got so tired of patronizing looks and suggestions about how I should improve my "autheticity" etc that I stopped. In fact, I stopped playing at all for about 2 years.

Anyway, I recently agreed to play at a local ladies' Irish cultural luncheon, and I'm afraid it's causing me a huge amount of anxiety--as if they'll find figure out I'm not a "real" Irish flute player and cast me into the pit of doom. Can anyone reassure me that it's all right to play Irish music on the flute without being Seamus Egan, or even wanting to be? J.P Cormier once told me that I shouldn't worry what other people think, but develop my own style--but it's really, really hard.

Thank you,

Caitlin

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 1:32 pm

I wouldn't worry about authenticity so much.

Play the music so that you enjoy it. If you honestly enjoy it, that will come through to your listeners.

As far as getting nervous before you play, that's something that I still struggle with from time to time, in spite of leading a weekly session that's steadily growing.

The more you play in public, the less nervous you'll get. And even though sometimes if you're like me you'll still get nervous, you'll be able to take that restless energy and put it into the music where it belongs.

Finally, I would offer this advice: if there are people who consistently and harshly criticize your playing, either don't play around (or for) them, or just avoid them entirely if possible. Life is too short to do otherwise.

--James

Wombat · Post by **Wombat** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:09 pm

People differ enormously in what they like. Some people only like pure drop Irish music, others only like more rocky, or poppy or easy listening or new age varieties. Others like a variety of styles. If you have no reason to suspect that your audience consists only, or largely, of pure drop fanatics, you've no need to worry. Probably most audiences who aren't pure drop enthusiasts would regard a style like the one you describe as your own as more approachable.

Ultimately our goal is musical enjoyment. There are a lot of very good players preserving the core of the tradition. There are also a lot of people around the edges playing music that they enjoy and that others enjoy.

I think we should all be grateful for, and respect, those musicians in all folk styles who are devoting their lives to the preservation of their tradition in at least a relatively pure form. But that doesn't mean that everybody has to follow them.

There's a nice story I heard recently from a friend playing at a session led by one of the top Irish American musicians. A couple approached the players and requested Danny Boy. The session musicians groaned, as you do. But the leader just smiled, picked up his concertina and played it for them solo. Then they went back to the session. Moral: everybody was happy.

whamlyn · Post by **whamlyn** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:20 pm

I think everyone at some point has had people criticize their playing. I've heard some really highly ornamented players and some not so highly ornamented players and they both sound great. Just as an example, I've a friend who is a brilliant fiddle player with a really straight-forward style... I can't ever remember hearing him play a roll! But he has this great sense of rhythm that gives his playing something that a lot of people lack. I've run into similar situations with flute players, some who try to ornament the heck out of every tune, and others who focus more on the rhythm and tempo to make the tune sound good with a minimum of ornaments. Both approaches can work well, or both approaches can sound horrible.

In the end, who gives a crap what other people have to say! Once playing stops being fun it's not worth doing... unless you're making a living at it and that's a whole other issue. Look at James, he has taken plenty of flack on the board and he keeps coming back for more!

Just don't forget the love...

Best,
Wes

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:23 pm

I have actually made authenticity my personal goal over the last several years, and the Scoiltrad lessons with Conal O'Grada have gotten me much closer to that goal.

I thought Wombat's point well-phrased, and I always try to remember that not every musician values in the same things in the music that I do.

Interestingly enough, our sessions began years ago as a on-again off-again, very eclectic jam session. Through the years we have finally settled into a weekly session which is almost completely IrTrad. I consider this progress and I consider myself fortunate to have been part of it.

--James

Edited: Wes, I didn't see your post, we must have posted at roughly the same time. You also have very valid points, all around.

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:25 pm

Ahh, The Danny Boy Conundrum. Funny, we were just talking about this after the session last night (where once again, we received the requisite furtive bar napkins requesting "The Wild Rover" and "Danny Boy"). My friend the ex-American/ex-Irish/exile composer calls it "Board Failte stuff" -- i.e., the music *most* people think of when they think of Irish trad.

BUT. (And I will admit a little snobbery because Wild Rover and Danny Boy aren't my favorite tunes) Very, very few people are obsessed enough with Da Music to have 10 or 20 or 30 or more CDs on permanent rotation in their players with nothing but Irtrad. In other words, Board Failte stuff is all they hear.

And besides .... how many times do we ourselves confuse certain tunes or parts of tunes; i.e., mix up, say, "Maid Behind the Bar" w/ "Green Mtn." etc. -- even though we play them quite regularly -- and admit that they kind of sound the same?

SO. Chances are, your lunch ladies won't know Brian Finnegan from Jack Coen, let alone a slip jig from a hop jig or heaven forbid, a tap from a cut or a cran from a long roll. Heck, 99% of the planet doesn't (myself included, most days) :roll:

Which is why you should just have fun, play because you love it, and get 'em tapping their feet -- because that's what it's really about, anyway.

But that's my own danged opinion.

Good luck!

P.S. I so share your pain; I've been in all those places you describe and still seem to revisit them on a regular basis. Just keep at it!

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:29 pm

P.S. Just saw the other posts while writing mine .... yes, we did play Danny Boy for the requester, and it was lovely. (:lol: at self)

Post by **Nanohedron** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:35 pm

To Hell with the begrudgers.

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:37 pm

Actually, there is a doubled irony here.

We played Danny Boy two weeks ago--actually just Pat and I played it--and it was indeed a request.

We didn't try to pretend it was an IrTrad tune though: I played it on silver flute and schmaltzed the hell out of it, tear-jerker vibrato and all. James Galway would'a been proud!

Seriously, when a person requests a song that means something to them, that is a compliment to the musicians, and should always be treated as such.

While we were thus occupied, the rest of the guys took a break, some stepped outside to smoke, a couple of others were chatting it up with the pretty little girl who works there.

--James

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:01 pm

Caitlin - First off, to anyone who pesters you because you're not playing a wooden flute, well, do your best to forget about them. Joannie Madden seems to do quite nicely on a Boehm flute as you say, and I've got some books with pictures of older players playing on Boehm system flutes...so they are not unheard of in ITM.

As for ornamentation, I think rhythm and energy are more important by far. Granted, this is just my own little opinion here. Just so you know you're not alone in preferring a limited amount of ornamention, John Creaven's CD "The Story so Far" is rather minimalist with regard to ornamentation and I think it's fantastic.

I'd say give playing out another try.

Eric

meemtp · Post by **meemtp** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:34 pm

We had a drunken patron ask us to play Lenyrd Skynard's "Freebird" one time. As much as we try to be accomodating to to audience requests, none of us could pull that off!

Corin

jim stone · Post by **jim stone** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 4:03 pm

Nanohedron wrote:To Hell with the begrudgers.

Second this. to put it in other words,

'Bleep 'em if they can't take a joke!'

If there is one thing that is manifest in
ITM, it's that nothing's wrong with lightly
ornamented music.

Courage, mon brave! Best

meemtp · Post by **meemtp** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 4:07 pm

The idea that ITM had to involve tons of ornamentation pretty much evolved out of the Coleman/Morrison and more recently, Molloy record influence. There have been many highly regarded ITM musicians, before and after, commercial and not who have used fairly straight ahead simple styles, to great effect.

Corin

rama · Post by **rama** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 4:10 pm

a ladies luncheon????

what do you think is going to happen...the ladies getting up hooting, hollering, showing off tatoos, dancing in the aisles and pounding the tables? or sitting, chatting, and politely drinking tea ?

msheldon · Post by **msheldon** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 4:14 pm

The "lead" flute player in the session I attend plays boehm-system flute and piccolo. And it would take a *very* brave person to try to criticise her playing as not being good enough. She can play circles around myself or any other flutist there, bar none.

It's not possible to make every person in the world satisfied. It *is* possible to satisfy your own wishes. Don't beat your head against the wall.