Home studio digital recording equipment - what's best?

Lorenzo · Post by **Lorenzo** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:56 pm

A couple of the bands I play in have/are recording CDs on these machines. One is a Fostex 16 channel multitrack recorder. It's not very user-friendly. Even our engineer wizard has to get the book out all the time on playback to remember how to run the thing. The other is a Korg D 16XD for 16 simultaneous tracks at a time. This one is new on the market and much more user-friendly. I've searched the web and see there are many others available.

Anyone have experience or recommendations for a "user-friendly" multitrack digital recorder? Minimum of 8 simultaneous tracks (8 mics) going at the same time...8 mic jacks, both 1/4 jack and XLR, 16 is better. The Korg D32XD (32 track) looks like it will get slashed in price next year by nearly 1/2 or more.

http://www.zzounds.com/cat--Korg-Digita ... ders--3162

djm · Post by **djm** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 1:53 pm

Lorenzo, I would suggest looking into a PC. There are lots of software solutions for recording, editting, dubbing, mixing, digital sound effects, all do-able on your PC. All you need is a hardware interface to sample the sound. I personally can recommend the Midiman interfaces.

None of the solutions I have seen, either harware of software, is particularly user-friendly. This has to do with the incredible number of options that various users have demanded over time. In hardware solutions, you run into the problem that all hardware switches, sliders and knobs cost a lot of money, and the more physical rerouting you do, the greater the potential to generate unwanted noise. So the manufacturers make the same few switches do multiple functions. In software, you can only look at so many items on one screen at a time, so things tend to get buried in menues and submenues and subsubmenues, etc. Its all very difficult to keep track of, no matter which route you choose.

All of this stuff is being geared more and more to someone who has taken college courses in sound recording, but even those people get bewildered by the number of choices. Most sound engineers learn one product and stick with it, just for the sake of their sanity.

I started my current PC out with Logic Audio Pro, but after banging my head against the (ab)users manual long enough, I turned to Cool Edit Pro, which meets all my simple needs admirably.

djm

Brian Lee · Post by **Brian Lee** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 2:18 pm

To do multi-track recording - to say nothing of getting a decent recording using "real" mics with balanced/grounded inputs etc. I believe you have to use an outboard mixer of some form. This is what I've seen anyway. In the few times I've gone in to the studio to record for CD projects there has always been a computer with some amazing editing programs, but there was also always a mixing board of some form to get everything into the computer.

I sure wish there was some other (cheaper) way to do it myself.

Bri~

Lorenzo · Post by **Lorenzo** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 2:37 pm

With my So. Am. Andean band, we used a computer program like Cool Edit Pro of some sort, and had a 32 channel mixing board. It worked okay, but the product wasn't that great, and it certainly wasn't user-friendly, though we hired a professional to do all the recording and mixing. He couldn't even figure out how to run all of his new equipment himself...it took us forever. I think good mixer boards, and all the other needed programs and equipment, cost about as much as some these new digital recorders (on sale), which burn their own CDs, some with compression capacity, some without. And, enough memory to record 100 hours worth of recordings. And they have all the edit junk built in...a mini computer of their own, plus they're portable--a big drawing card.

AlanB · Post by **AlanB** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 6:05 pm

Lorenzo,

I'm sure you know that the soundcard dictates the quality , and the programme merely manipulates your recordings. If you're running a decent spec PC, you can get a half way usable s/c for around $250.

I have recently had a whack at Nuendo by Steinberg, kind of like a budget pro tools, or a posh Cubase

I reckon PC is the way to go for budget home recording with a wide range of upgrade possibilities as you go which is not so likely on a Hard Disk multitrack.

Or sell your pipes and get a Mac G5...

Alan

djm · Post by **djm** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 6:52 pm

Lorenzo, some of the noise could be coming from the board itself. It is not necessary if you have a multi-input card like the Midiman. Software can do the mix for you.

Another thing that will affect sound is the sampling rate. Record high, burn low, i.e. record at 64K, but CDs are only recorded at 44.1K. You can always take out, but you can't put back in.

AlanB has a really good point. The PC is easily upgraded, the all-in-one hardware solutions are usually not, or at least, not as flexible.

The final choice is yours, of course. Get another engineer, one who is familiar with your setup, or take some college courses on sound recording and engineering, but be careful of their urge for perfection and the most expensive equipment available.

djm

Lorenzo · Post by **Lorenzo** » Mon Nov 24, 2003 7:35 pm

Thanks for the advice, guys. I'll be looking into it.

ElAdrel · Post by **ElAdrel** » Tue Nov 25, 2003 2:22 pm

The 'Roland VS - 1824' is a great 24 track digital studio, easy to use with plenty of in - built effects and CD writer. It will pretty much do anything you could possibly want, I've recorded some fairly proffesional CD's on mine.

Lorenzo · Post by **Lorenzo** » Tue Nov 25, 2003 4:43 pm

The Roland VS 1824 is a nice recorder but only records 8 tracks simultaneously, I think. The Roland VS 2480 is selling for incredibly low prices on eBay right now, $2,000 +/-.

I looked into getting all the gadgetry to upgrade my computer for 12-16 simultaneous inputs, and it requires a lot more than just a mixer board--which only gives 2 lines into the computor. I'd need at least 12 access lines in. Plus, I'd have to get a new computer to upgrade the hardrive necessary to equal 80GB necessary, like some of these portable boxes.

AlanB · Post by **AlanB** » Tue Nov 25, 2003 5:20 pm

Even if you have a 16 track HD recorder, you will probably only have 8 inputs maximum at any given time. For somewhere at a guess $2000 will get you a really good soundcard with at least 8 inputs. and a 20gb HD is pennies these days and is enough to work with, just keep backing up.

Maybe you need a straightforward HD recorder with 8 in and an external 24:8 mixer ??? Don't forget to save some back for a decent mic or 4, or else it will be all for nothing.........

Alan

Chadd · Post by **Chadd** » Tue Nov 25, 2003 7:53 pm

Microphones, mic preamps, AD converters, mixing environment, DA converters, monitors, room treatment.; the system will only be as good as it's weakest link, so don't blow the whole budget on just one or two parts. If you think you'll be staying at it for a while, I'd recommend avoiding the all-in-one solutions so you can upgrade components one at a time as you can afford it.

djm · Post by **djm** » Tue Nov 25, 2003 9:32 pm

Delta Midiman 1010 from M-Audio gives you ten in/ten out PCI recording.
http://www.m-audio.com/products/m-audio/delt1010.php
Several other options there as well. This is very good stuff.

If your PC is too old to handle an 80GB HD it may be time to upgrade anyway. Minimum 1.4 GHz CPU. Get lotsa RAM, at least 526MB.

You haven't really said where you're trying to go with all this stuff. You're not going to be able to compete with a multi-million dollar pro studio, but you should be able to cut decent demos, or CDs for your friends.

djm

Lorenzo · Post by **Lorenzo** » Wed Nov 26, 2003 12:10 pm

Hey, thanks again. I beginning to wonder myself where I'm going with all this stuff. I had to look back at my original post to see where I was at. I guess I was just wondering if anyone had a recommendation, or actually had a setup that they were pleased with that was user-friendly, esp. experience with these portable home studios for 12-16 simultaneous mic plug-ins.

Nice stuff, that Delta 1010 for $800. I think it only has 8 lines in and out, according to the description anyway. But my computer could handle the requirements except for the Pentium processor. I'm using a Celeron equivilant. I think it might pay me to upgrade though.