WTT - Daylight Visible Beneath The Blade

[raindog1970]

I've been making my mouthpieces very similar to Sindts for a few months now, and have been making the blade edge flush with the windway floor.
Looking down the windway, no daylight is visible underneath the blade... as is common in most high-end whistles.
After reading the recent posts on how to pick out the best cheapies by a visual inspection of the blade position, I tried making a mouthpiece with the blade positioned slightly above the windway floor... and the results were impressive!
This modification took much of the 'edge' off the tone, and somewhat strengthened the lower notes.
While I'm not sure I'll change the design of my retrofit heads to incorporate this feature, I do think it will be standard on my complete whistles.
Anybody more knowledgable on the subject of whistle mouthpiece design care to comment on this?

[illuminatus99]

I'd imagine that moving the blade up like that would decrease back-pressure as well as give the whistle more volume at the cost of increasing air consumption

[Jerry Freeman]

I find that it decreases backpressure only slightly. It seems to increase the volume somewhat, create a more "open" sound to the voicing, like the whistle sings out a little more effortlessly, and it can bring the upper register more into match with the lower, both in volume (makes the upper louder) and in timbre.

As you increase the height of the soundblade above the windway floor further, on many whistles, the upper register becomes purer (less complex) and louder and begins to sound different from the lower register. As you lower the soundblade, the timbre usually becomes more complex and softer. There's a sweet spot where the upper register matches the lower in both loudness and complexity, and that's the ideal soundblade height. All this assumes the windway height and window length are already good. (And I'm assuming some whistles may be exceptions to this scheme altogether.)

And, of course, if the soundblade is altogether too high above the windway floor, the wistle will be unstable, breathy or downright unplayable.

Best wishes,
Jerry

[TonyHiggins]

Reading these topics makes me wish I were a whistle maker, but, no way is that going to happen. I don't have enough time to practice as much as I'd like and get my science fiction read in a timely manner and (do all the stuff my wife wants done to the home ) and do some exercise, and so on and so forth.

But it makes me wonder about various whistles I have. Wouldn't it be cool to custom voice everything to your heart's delight? How about a whistle with an adjustable blade/windway/fipple with little adjusting knobs on the sides? You let your friend try it: "Don't touch those knobs or I'll break your fingers!"
Tony

[Jerry Freeman]

Little rack and pinion voicing mechanisms. Would you like the rosewood voicing knobs or the ebony with faux ivory inlay?

(BTW ... Gary, you've made my day.)

[raindog1970]

(BTW ... Gary, you've made my day.)

Should I take that to mean that your whistle tweaking has taught you the same thing about blade positioning?
Yes, it was your posts that prompted me to try raising the blade a bit... you're going to have to get that lathe up and running soon, and leave the rest of us whistle makers in your dust!

[Jerry Freeman]

... you're going to have to get that lathe up and running soon, and leave the rest of us whistle makers in your dust!

Not. I'm beyond impressed by what you whistlemakers do. It's magic.

I am getting closer to prototyping a "from scratch" whistle. I think I know what design I want to start with. Now it's a matter of finding the materials and the time.

Best wishes,
Jerry

[RonKiley]

Now my question is: What is the relationship between window width and length with respect to blade height? BTW I have seen several designs recently that deviate quite a bit from the normal blade ramp. Are there some new approaches to whistle making?

Ron

[raindog1970]

Now my question is: What is the relationship between window width and length with respect to blade height?

Ron, I don't think there necessarily is a relationship between them... other than the fact that each has its own effect on the characteristics of the finished whistle.
The more I learn, the more I'm amazed at how many different factors are involved in the 'personality' of any given whistle.
It's definitely an educational experience to take up whistle making... but it's also a lot of fun!

[serpent]

Well, at the request (behest) of one of our more recent Chiff and Fipplers, I moved back in time, so to speak, and made a copper Village Smithy, Olde Style (square head). I incorporated all the stuff I've learnt in making whistles for over a year now, and that thing is just plain sweet to play! some of the following is totally relevant...

Wanted some chiff, so I lifted the blade 0.010 off the windway floor
Wanted some pure, so I put a small chamfer on the fipple plug
Wanted some loud, so I made the window 0.8 X tube width, and length equal to 0.6 X window width.
Wanted some backpressure, so I made the windway 0.04 high, full width.
Wanted more pure, so I set the blade angle at 45 degrees and polished it and minutely rounded the edge.

Additionally, I used Flutomat (THANK YOU, PETER KOSEL!!!) to get the thing in tune perfectly, and balanced all the way up, including crossfingerings.

As a result of these meanderings, I have decided to offer the copper VS Olde Style, on my website. I LOVE THIS WHISTLE! Info will be available online in a few days.

serpent

[brewerpaul]

There is actually a recorder out there that does have an adjustable plug. Never played one though.
FWIW-- due to their design, the bottom of my whistle blades is exactly the same height of the fipple top, but you can still see a sliver of daylight in there.

[antstastegood]

serpent - does the flutomat calculator give it an accurate C natural?

[serpent]

serpent - does the flutomat calculator give it an accurate C natural?

Right on the money, according to Mr. Korg. OXXOOO fingering. But bear in mind that the calculator does NOT figure out the hole-to-hole or hole-to-diameter ratios for that. I start out with the following "rule of thumb" when setting up a whistle for the first time (#1 hole is on the bottom):

Hole Diameters
1 < 2
2 > 3
3 < 1
4 >= 1
5 >= 4
6 < 4

For my high D Viper (0.625 OD, 0.040 wall), that works out to:
1, 4, and 5 = 0.25"
2 = 0.3125"
3 and 6 = 0.190"

I find that, using similar ratios, I can come within a few cents, first try, on most whistles now. Caveat being that, as the diameter of the whistle gets larger, you have to "tweak" the hole sizes down to avoid stuff like 3/4" diameter fingerholes. To me, the maximum usable fingerhole diameter should probably not exceed 0.4375"

I would suggest that having a set of drills in 1/64" (0.015625") increments is a Good Thing, if you're trying to achieve perfect tuning. I actually do use those increments in a couple of my designs.
Cheers,
serpent

[fearfaoin]

Serpent,
Flutomat looks like just what I need, but I keep getting javascript errors, so it won't calculate! Darn!

I am using http://www.cwo.com/~ph_kosel/flutomat.html to access the site... Is this the page you use? Is it currently working for you?

The 8-hole version, now that I try that, works fine, but the 6-hole does nothing. We may have to alert the good Mr. Kosel if this is a widespread problem...

[RonKiley]

I just tried your url and I didn't have any trouble. BTW you guys have given me some great information. Maybe one day soon I can produce a whistle that sounds the way I want it. So far one low D that takes too much air and is quite breathy and one G flute that plays better than I do.

Ron