A Re****er question

FJohnSharp · Post by **FJohnSharp** » Sun Oct 19, 2003 10:00 pm

A friend of mine (God help her) wants to learn recorder and asked what kind she should buy. She was told not to get a wooden one unless she got a good one. She asked if a cheap plastic one was okay to start with. I do not know. I do know that she is on a very tight budget.

Suggestions please?

Thank you in advance. I will work on converting her to whistle while you deliberate.

DCrom · Post by **DCrom** » Sun Oct 19, 2003 10:51 pm

Though if she's at all serious she'll eventually move on to something better, the cheap plastic Yamaha and Aulos recorders are surprisingly good. I'm far from a recorder expert, but I've dabbled with them for years.

Back when I was playing in a (very) amateur recorder consort we were told to all buy the Yamaha C sopranos to start with - they were in tune (and in tune with each other), required minimal care, and had no real quirks to play around. Think of them as the Sweetones of the recorder world and you wouldn't be far off.

I don't much like the Yamaha F sopranino, but I don't much like ANY sopranino - even my medium-sized fingers barely fit. My Yamaha C soprano is OK. I think the Yamaha F alto is quite nice, as is my Aulos C tenor when I'm in the mood for it. And except for the C tenor, you could buy any of them - probably all of them - for less than $50.

skh · Post by **skh** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 12:03 am

Yamaha, Dolmetsch, Aulos, or Mollenhauer Prima (half wood, half plastic). As the solo instrument in baroque times was the alto, most of the serious literature is written for that instrument, not for soprano. An alto is also easier on the ears, so maybe she should consider starting with that right away.

Sonja

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 2:07 am

Seconding Sonja's advice a beginner adult could as well start out from an Alto recorder.

IMHO, however, the lower you get, the poorer plastic sounds compared with wood: correct as soprani, acceptable as alti, yucch as tenor.

I also believe that advising against wood is prejudice: most factory-produced wooden recorders, i.e. the most affordable ones, are made of wood (often maple) impregnated with resin, or durably coated with hard varnishes. They're also extremely consistent from sample to sample.

Also, the "recorder sound" may be more typical of baroque (bore, not fingering as opposed to German/modern). Renaissance recorders have a more open sound, greater range. There's a revival of this wider, less conical bores, with new developments like Adriana's Breuking) "Dream recorder", available about anywhere in soprano, and often alto. Looks cool for Renfairs, too

See for description http://www.mollenhauer.com/shop/de/dept_23.html

and for source, price, try http://www.susato.com/mollenha.htm (search for "Renaissance" or scroll to the end of the page).

PS: Edited to ad the guy Paul Busman down there knows recorders--and whistles!--better than I ever will.
He makes good whistles and plays good recorder

... so if a "got wood?" fine whistles maker tells you a Yamaho alto plastic recorder is ok with him, you can trust him.

Though, there might be a cunning, Florentian (Florensick?), Borghese! ploy here: advising the crappiest cheap far-East recorders, so you keep a taste--and budget!--for high-end whistles. We don't want you to spend all your whistle money on expensive Bressan things, after all...

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 5:11 am

I've been terrifically happy with all of the Yamahas, from soprano right down to tenor. For performance I use good quality wood instruments ( I have a Von Huene alto) except for my tenor which is a Yamaha plastic. The third recorder player in our group uses a Yamaha plastic alto with the wood grain finish and from the audience you literally can't tell the difference. These are excellent instruments at very reasonable prices.

Hiro Ringo · Post by **Hiro Ringo** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 6:14 am

One of the reason why I have not liked plastic recorders usually is because the maker has not seemed to devote enough time/effort on voicing,not because they have been made of plastic. I think. But things keep changing....plastic recorders have kept getting better.

Yeah,the most audience might not be able to tell the difference between wooden and plastic(or they might not be interested in the difference so much).

Actually players and audience listen to the sound differently. And very good instruments sound very good to players at first and after that they can sound easily good to audience.

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:53 am

I have played a plastic Zen-On Bressan Alto that was a very good, responsive instrument.

I don't think they are being made anymore, but at one time Adege recorders in exotic hardwoods were an extreme good value and a very stable, dependable instrument.

--James

BrassBlower · Post by **BrassBlower** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 12:03 pm

I have a plastic soprano recorder by Gill, which I bought for about $5. It sounds perfectly OK to me. It is quite loud, but doesn't have a terribly high air requirement.

kevin m. · Post by **kevin m.** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 1:46 pm

O.K.-for the purposes of 'helping' a fellow Fippler,I'll come clean-I...I bought a RECORDER today

There,I said it!
My excuse is that I have been listening to quite a bit of Baroque music lately.
Anyway,the Recorder that I purchased is an Aulos 905A Alto,and I'm very pleased with it. It cost £27.95,which is extremely reasonable,compared to some whistles (though of course it IS factory,rather than hand made).
Whilst in the shop,I tried a Yamaha,and a cheaper Aulos model,but preferred this one.I did a little research when I got home(this should have been done BEFORE shopping, of course),and I was delighted to read on the 'Saunders recorder shop' website,that this is the model that the proprietor recommends to adult beginners!

I just need to adjust to some of the fingerings, in comparison to whistleand flute,and I should be away.I managed to play a half recognisable take on Carolan's 'The Princess Royal' after about 30 minutes.
This cross-fippling is rather fun!

glauber · Post by **glauber** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 1:48 pm

If i felt compelled to buy a serious first alto or soprano rec*rder, this is what i'd get:
http://leecollins.com/custom.htm

I have a Yamaha plastic tenor, BTW, and it sounds very good. Can't beat the price!

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 3:38 pm

glauber wrote:If i felt compelled to buy a serious first alto or soprano rec*rder...

Zen-On makes a surprisingly good soprano; the alto, I never heard or tried.

Are these tweaked Zen-On much better?

glauber · Post by **glauber** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:47 pm

They must be, the guy says they've even been used "in concert"!

I see these as the recorder-world equivalent of a Jerrytone.

Hiro Ringo · Post by **Hiro Ringo** » Mon Oct 20, 2003 11:09 pm

kevin m. wrote:O.K.-for the purposes of 'helping' a fellow Fippler,I'll come clean-I...I bought a RECORDER today
There,I said it!

You crossed that line?!

Oh well, no turning back....

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Tue Oct 21, 2003 5:12 am

glauber wrote:They must be, the guy says they've even been used "in concert"!

I see these as the recorder-world equivalent of a Jerrytone.

The tweaked Zen-On altos are quite good ( I have one). They actually take out the plastic fipple block and resurface it with a slip of cedar, which is the traditional recorder fipple wood. The result is a smoother playing instrument which does not clog up nearly as fast as an all plastic one.

mamakash · Post by **mamakash** » Tue Oct 21, 2003 8:00 am

Can anyone post a link for a fingering chart for an alto recorder? I went looking last night, but couldn't find one.