Low D???

[Zubivka]

I think a Howard Low D is good choice and it's not to expensive (100$ in England)
Did you already play an Alba Low Whistle?

I like the Howard Low C, IMHO superior to the same in D.
However, I have a wide bore Alba Low C which is impressive, not only IMO but of others, way better players, who had the opportunity to play it at Mesquer's LA Session last festival.
The sound of recent Alba Low D remains breathier than the Howard, but fuller too, esp. on very low end; wind requirements are similar. You may call the sound "woody" for a metal whistle.
Also Alba tend to have one of the easiest fingerings for a Low D.
Finally, at an equivalent price to the Howard, you also get a hand-made instrument with a clearly superior finish.

[illuminatus99]

I'm a big fan of my howard, it'll get me through until I save up enough for a copeland, even then I'll probably still play it when I want something chiffy

[Parcour25]

In fact, - for two more days - you can make a $10 raffle purchase/donation to serpents friend and buy a serpent low d whistle at 1/2 price. I know, you have NO IDEA what I'm talking about.... hehehe.


Has Mr.Copeland ever made a low d in nickle? All i've seen are brass and sterling.

Do the Burke ez's come in 3 pc., or only 2?

[NicoMoreno]

I don't like Howards. The sound to me is too weak. Very quiet, and difficult to switch between octaves cleanly.
I tried one, and a person at the local session has one. But they could both have been "old" ones...

[stefpat]

Low D recapitulation:
*******************************
Do you agree with me? is it correct?


Burke Composite EZ model
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (plastic)
Weight: very light

Copeland
*******************************
Price: most expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/highest finish
Weight: heavy

Overton
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (alu)
Weight: not to heavy

Chieftains
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (alu)
Weight: not to heavy

Howard
*******************************
Price: not expensive
Sound: clear but not strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: not easy
Fingering: not easy with big holes
Aspect: industrial (painted brass)
Weight: heavy

Alba
*******************************
Price: not expensive
Sound: woody, pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/highest finish (polished alu)
Weight: not to heavy

Shaw
*******************************
Price: not expensive
Sound: woody, clear but not strong
Wind requirement: a lot
Switch Octave: not easy
Fingering: very easy, small holes
Aspect: industrial (bend iron, nickel)
Weight: very heavy

Dixon
*******************************
Price: very cheap
Sound: clear and but not strong
Wind requirement: not much
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy, small holes
Aspect: industrial (black plastic)
Weight: very light

Susato
*******************************
Price: cheap
Sound: clear and not strong
Wind requirement: not much
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: easy
Aspect: industrial (black plastic)
Weight: light

Do you agree with me? is it correct?
Thanks, Stefpat

[Jens_Hoppe]

Ugh, that's quite a list. Of the low Ds I've tried I have the following comments:

Copeland
*******************************
Sound: pure, clear and strong

Depends on what you mean with "pure" and "clear", but I'd describe the Copeland's tone as quite complex. Definitely strong though.

Overton
*******************************
Sound: pure, clear and strong

Again, the Overton low D has perhaps the most complex and overtone-rich sound of all low whistles. Pure and clear is not the way I'd describe the sound of an Overton.

Chieftains
*******************************
Sound: pure, clear and strong

Pure and clear are better terms for Chieftains, since their tone, although Overton-like, is somewhat less complex, and a bit more "pure".

Howard
*******************************
Sound: clear but not strong
Weight: heavy

The Howard I had had a very strong tone. Also, as far as I recall, it wasn't particularly heavy compared to Overtons/Chieftains.


Jens

[Wombat]

Small disagreements aside, I think Jens has given a pretty accurate decription of the sound for the whistles I have tried (most of them.)

[Wombat]

I don't like Howards. The sound to me is too weak. Very quiet, and difficult to switch between octaves cleanly.
I tried one, and a person at the local session has one. But they could both have been "old" ones...

Brian Howard was one of the pioneers of the low whistle but has been frequently modifying and improving his design, especially his mouthpieces. A lot of criticism of Howards seems to be based on experience with instruments many years out of date.

I have a fairly recent low C which I like very much. (I believe the design has improved again since I bought mine about three years ago.) Like any low C, mine is hard to play and has big holes. When I play it again after months in it's case, at first it sounds weak and weazy. It begins to sound full and strong throughout its range as soon as I start covering the holes properly and get a proper seal. In my case, the problems are with the player and not the instrument and resolve themselves quickly with practice.

[lixnaw]

hi stephane,

i didn't expect anything less from a fellow from switzerland. questions as acurate as a swiss clock, i'll try and do the same. but if i where you i'd trust my ears and listen to samples, then there'll be less options to choose from.

i think the low D EZ composite has a realy down to earth tone, it's also very sweet, it also has the richest tone of all the whistles you mentioned. the plastic is a mixture of woodfiber and thermoset resin, baked on very high tempereture. this material doesn't need any warming up. even if you put it in the deepfriezer, it's ready to play(but hard on the lips ). i also find this whistle more woody then an alba

in contrast, every aluminium whistle needs warming up before it's in tune.
the low D EZ aluminium is more pure then the composite and not so down to earth, more sweet and pure. the octave switch is the easyest on the burkes. you don't have to blow harder to reach a high note either.

i think the shaw whistle is not very clear, if you like chiffie, all the better

you have to like the back pressure on the copeland(lean in with your breath), some love it, some don't. i think the copeland is rather chiffie, not so much as the shaw.

the back pressure on the overton can be reduced if you give colin goldie a ring about this, you can also choose from narrow to wide bore and hole spacing. or have your whistle anodized in any colour.

i think the alba, next to the burke composite, has the most grounding tone and is also sweat. the octave switch is very easy, but not so easy as on the burkes. the holespacing is about the same as the dixon.

i think the susato takes a lot of wind. the holespacing is even bigger then on an alba low C

[lixnaw]

[/quote ] http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php ... highlight= did you change your mind my burke low C will arrive in two weeks!(improved version)

[lixnaw]

I don't like Howards. The sound to me is too weak. Very quiet, and difficult to switch between octaves cleanly.
I tried one, and a person at the local session has one. But they could both have been "old" ones...

Brian Howard was one of the pioneers of the low whistle but has been frequently modifying and improving his design, especially his mouthpieces. A lot of criticism of Howards seems to be based on experience with instruments many years out of date.

I have a fairly recent low C which I like very much. (I believe the design has improved again since I bought mine about three years ago.) Like any low C, mine is hard to play and has big holes. When I play it again after months in it's case, at first it sounds weak and weazy. It begins to sound full and strong throughout its range as soon as I start covering the holes properly and get a proper seal. In my case, the problems are with the player and not the instrument and resolve themselves quickly with practice.

http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php ... highlight= did you change your mind . my low C will arrive in two weeks time, improved version!

(only a fool will never change his mind about anything)

[Wombat]

Thanks for reminding me of that, lixnaw. Well I did change my mind but not about the desirablility of getting a Burke but rather about whether I could make the Howard do the job for the time being. I now think it can.

I'd still like to get a low-ish low Burke other than D. I have enough Ds already. So the choice is between C (where I have the Howard) and Eb (where I have an Overton). I'm leaning slightly towards the Eb at the moment because I use it more than the C—I seem to play a lot in F minor as well as Eb. I really do like Burkes a lot so I could easily end up with lots more.

[lixnaw]

Thanks for reminding me of that, lixnaw. Well I did change my mind but not about the desirablility of getting a Burke but rather about whether I could make the Howard do the job for the time being. I now think it can.

I'd still like to get a low-ish low Burke other than D. I have enough Ds already. So the choice is between C (where I have the Howard) and Eb (where I have an Overton). I'm leaning slightly towards the Eb at the moment because I use it more than the C—I seem to play a lot in F minor as well as Eb. I really do like Burkes a lot so I could easily end up with lots more.

here you see stephane, yet another case of terrible WHOA= people who are not 100% sure before they buy.

[Bloomfield]

Low D recapitulation:
*******************************
Do you agree with me? is it correct?


Burke Composite EZ model
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (plastic)
Weight: very light

Copeland
*******************************
Price: most expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/highest finish
Weight: heavy

Overton
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (alu)
Weight: not to heavy

Chieftains
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (alu)
Weight: not to heavy

Howard
*******************************
Price: not expensive
Sound: clear but not strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: not easy
Fingering: not easy with big holes
Aspect: industrial (painted brass)
Weight: heavy

Alba
*******************************
Price: not expensive
Sound: woody, pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/highest finish (polished alu)
Weight: not to heavy

Shaw
*******************************
Price: not expensive
Sound: woody, clear but not strong
Wind requirement: a lot
Switch Octave: not easy
Fingering: very easy, small holes
Aspect: industrial (bend iron, nickel)
Weight: very heavy

Dixon
*******************************
Price: very cheap
Sound: clear and but not strong
Wind requirement: not much
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy, small holes
Aspect: industrial (black plastic)
Weight: very light

Susato
*******************************
Price: cheap
Sound: clear and not strong
Wind requirement: not much
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: easy
Aspect: industrial (black plastic)
Weight: light

Do you agree with me? is it correct?
Thanks, Stefpat

I can't quite agree with this summary. Things have been said about the tone. Here are a few other points:

Susato Low D fingering is not easy. It is the hardest, most awkward of any whislte I've played. Wind requirements for the Susato are on the high side, and you need much more breath in upper register.

The Shaw low D is not heavy, but very very light, since it is just rolled tin. Consider getting one from Jerry Freeman, he tweaks them to make them wonderful and special whistles. They are the most breathy (air sounds along with the tone) Low Ds.

The Alba Low D is heavy. It has very high breath requirements. The tone isn't "pure" but has a bit chiffy, is strong and beautiful. It is the most beautiful of the (metal or plastic) low D, with perhaps the exception of the Copelands. Despite the high breath requirements it does play easily and smoothly.

Chieftains: I don't know what you mean by "superior finish" but if it's what I think it is, the Chieftains don't have it. They are, plain and the most utilitarian looking whistle. The tone on the ones I've playd was okay, although I've played one or two nice ones (I've played a nice Low E recently). None of the Overton magic, though (that's just my opinion, of course).

I don't think you can call Burkes "hand-made".

Finally, the Overton:

Overton
*******************************
Price: expensive
Sound: pure, clear and strong
Wind requirement: normal
Switch Octave: easy
Fingering: very easy
Aspect: hand made/superior finish (alu)
Weight: not to heavy

The Overtons are not expensive. They are the cheapest if you consider value/price. Silkstones are more expensive , if you can believe it, and Burkes and Chieftains are about the same. The Chieftains are completely mashine-manufactured (I doubt they are even voiced by hand), and the Burkes are mashine tooled and voiced by hand, checked by Mike Burke (if I remember this correctly). The Overtons are completely handmade, and you can order them to specifications, at no extra charge. They are also the most consistent whistles you can get.

I won't go into the sound again, except to say that the Overton sound is THE low D sound. Wind requirements are not "normal". you can call them high, if you are talking about pressure (how much breath support do you need) or you can call them low, if you are talking about volume (how often to you need to take a breath). I agree that switching octaves is easy, as is fingering.

On weight: Copeland is heaviest, then the aluminum ones: Overton, Alba, Chieftain, Howard, then the plastic ones (Dixon, Susato, Burke Composite), and the lightest is the Shaw.

[Ridseard]

[quote="Bloomfield"I don't think you can call Burkes "hand-made".[/quote]
Which has negative connotations, especially when Chieftains are included in a comparison. It should, however, be noted that the use of machines in the manufacture of Burkes is largely responsible for their remarkable consistency. However it is done, the fit and finish of these whistles is practically flawless.