Two Beginner Theories

Flamman · Post by **Flamman** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 8:31 am

I'm starting with a much-maligned, beat-up, hand-me-down Soodlum. The sound is lovely, and I can hit all the notes pretty easily. The same cannot be said of the new Susato, Clare and Clarke whistles I bought. I have problems with all. Harsh and breathy on the higher notes, if I can hit them at all.
FIRST THEORY: It's not the whistle, it's the player. In time, my mouth and fingers will figure out each whistle's personality. So far, not true, but I wonder if my instincts are correct.
SECOND THEORY: If I can't figure out a Clarke, Clare and Susato, then it's a mistake to think I can get an easier play and a better sound by buying a higher-end whistle.
Comments?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Flamman on 2001-11-29 09:33 ]</font>

Jens_Hoppe · Post by **Jens_Hoppe** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 9:00 am

While the whistles you have tried may very well have been defective in some way, I would think your theory #1 is likely to be correct: Given enough practice on, and familiarity with a whistle, every (non-defective) whistle is certainly playable.

Whether you would find expensive whistles easier to play or not is another question altogether, and certainly depends on the whistle in question. Some expensives are best described as high-quality versions of the average Generation/Soodlum kind of whistle, whereas others are significantly different.

If at present you find the Soodlum easy to play, I'd say stick with it. But give the other whistles a try once in a while. With time I suspect you will suddenly find them not-as-bad as you do now.

Jens

celt5 · Post by **celt5** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 9:41 am

Hi,

It may just take getting used to the other whistles since they all play differently. I started playing on a Feadog D and have used it almost exclusively until recently. When I first got my susato D, it took me awhile before I was able to get a good tone in the 2nd octave. It was just a matter of getting used to the air requirements and how to focus the air for that whistle.
You may also want to give the Clark Sweetone a try. I recently required one in C and it's a breeze to play.

Flamman · Post by **Flamman** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 9:46 am

You hit the nail on the head about the Susato. The second octave was precisely my problem.

garycrosby · Post by **garycrosby** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 9:54 am

Assuming that your whistle are not defective then I would assume that it is not your whistles that are the problem but rather it is your technique (i.e., Theory One). A good whistle player should be able to play any decent instrument but a lesser one will have difficulty with some. A more expensive instrument is not going to solve the problem just like a more expensive car isn't going to turn you into a better driver.

As a relative newbie to whistledom I would agree with Jens_Hoppe who suggested you practice with your Soodlum and try other whistles periodically. IMO when you are trying to learn the basics constantly switching whistles just hinders the learning process. I've been playing whistle for about 10 months now and I still play > 75% of the time on my Sweetone because its *so* easy. I often learn new tunes to a reasonable level of proficiency on it before playing them on my other whistles. On my other whistles I play scales and refine songs that I am already proficient with. Additionally, I try to only play two different whistles per week (a sweetone and something else) - any more than that confuses me.

I think as you practice you will find that whistles you have diffficulty playing now will become easier. When I first got my Chieftain I had a lot of trouble and actually put it away for a couple of months. Then, one day I tried it again and I was stunned by how well I could play it - of course the whistle hadn't changed but my technique had improved a lot

Further to Celt5 remarks, I would suggest a Clarke Sweetone - it is remarkably easy to play and their quality control is pretty good so it is likely you won't get one that is defective (the same cannot be said for many of the other entry-level brands). In fact, its so easy that my 5 year old daughter can learn a simple tune on it in only a few minutes. IMO the Sweetone seems very "forgiving" of subtle changes in air pressure whereas others are not so forgiving. It was originally designed for children (hence the bright colours) but IMO is well suited to anyone who is just beginning. The high B tends to be sharp on Sweetones - I don't know why?

Martin Milner · Post by **Martin Milner** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 10:02 am

For myself I found the first theory to be true.

I think it's worth learning a tune on whatever your current favourite is, then trying it out on your other whistles. In time you should get used to them all (or maybe they will get used to you...)

I found I was getting squeaks out of many of my whistles, so switched to a Clarke Original, Tony Dixon or Walton Mellow D. Now I can play Feadog, Generation or Clare with no trouble. My Doolin still gives a little trouble, but is probably my least played whistle.

Your Clare might benefit from the BluTack tweak, but the Susato & Clarke can't be tweaked & shouldn't need it.

I wouldn't spend a wedge on a high-end whistle just yet, many players stick to cheap whistles all their lives. Give it a few months, and if possible try some other whistles out - maybe there's one out there that'll really suits you.

Tom_Gaul · Post by **Tom_Gaul** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 4:33 pm

Flamman,

Just a word of warning about the D Susato. This is one whistle that is notorious on this board for the shrillness and the difficulty of playing the upper notes in the second octave. On the other hand I found the C Susato quite nice and it was one of my favorite whistles before I began playing Sindt and Burke whistles.

Good luck with your playing

nickb · Post by **nickb** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 4:46 pm

The Susato whistle is notorious for its loud, shrieking, difficult to play higher octave, so in that case it is probably the whistle, not you. The Clark whistles (I'm assuming yours is a traditional whistle not a sweetone)can vary in quality a little so you might have a lemon there. They are cheap to buy so try another one and see if things get better.
I have never played a clare, so I can't offer any advice there.
since you are a beginner it could be something you are doing wrong, or you could be a beginner trying to play some bad whistles.

JohnPalmer · Post by **JohnPalmer** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 6:19 pm

Howdy,

I've seen (heard) many beginners not be able to play a nice-sounding note in the second octave on one of my Burkes. So I have concluded that it is a person's inability to support a note up high, rather than the inability of the whistle. I still believe that a whistle takes a lot of breath support, not just a lot of air, to play correctly. And I don't recall seeing very much written on this board about breath support. JP

Bretton · Post by **Bretton** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 8:12 pm

<font size=-1 color=blue>
And I don't recall seeing very much written on this board about breath support. JP</font>

What do you mean by breath support? Is it the same or different from breath control?
Does it have anything to do with Embouchure (sp?). I know embouchure is not something usually discussed concerning whistles, but one of my whistle instructors suggested this might help mellow out the highest notes on my Copeland (by blowing a smaller stream of air into the mouthpiece).

-brett

Jim W · Post by **Jim W** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 9:02 pm

Regarding Susato D - I sure find it to be quite shrill at A and above. I wonder if this is because the same "mouthpiece" fits the D, C, and Bb whistles? When it's attached to the C or Bb, the shrillness is gone. As an aside, once when I was disassembling my A Susato, the "mouthpiece" came apart where it was glued. This whistle had some difficult notes; when I reglued it, I experimented with moving the position of the end piece, and wound up with a much better playing whistle.

JohnPalmer · Post by **JohnPalmer** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 1:24 am

Hey Bretton,

I guess breath support and breath control are the same. I usually think of my air as a huge, solid wall of air, that I aim at the mouthpiece with my throat. The air really does determine what kind of sound is produced. I think that one of the best ways to a better tone is to learn to play the upper notes as quietly as possible, without falling into the first octave.

JP

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 7:27 am

Stick with the cheapie whistles for now. As a beginner, you don't even really know what characteristics you truly like in a whistle, nor are you equipped to test-play an expensive one adequately. If you want to consider the more expensive whistles, I'd suggest buying one for yourself as a reward for some sort of musical milestone-- perhaps when you can play 10 different tunes confidently and from memory ( slow and fast). At that point, you'll be a pretty fair whistle player, and can make a better judgement before laying out a lot of money. If you like wood, contact me...

Flamman · Post by **Flamman** » Sun Dec 02, 2001 9:42 pm

You guys all have been a big help. I think the expensive-whistle-as-reward theory makes sense, and could enhance my budgetary bargaining position (vis-a-vis my generally supportive but non-whistle playing spouse) when the time comes. (Not for a good while, I am sure.) I have given much thought to the question of embouchure and breath control. I do notice that by experimenting a bit, after a while I can get a better sound. Doing scales up and down for a bit on the non-cooperative whistle also helps. But for now, I'm mostly sticking with the whistle that feels most comfortable, and trying hard not to accidentally sit on it.