Rudall & Rose 8 Key On Ebay

[TWO TOOTS]

Hello Folks, I thought this one might interest a few of you.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Antique-8-Key ... SwB4NW1cSy

[TWO TOOTS]

Serial number looks pretty indistinct. Maybe 2085 ? If so, possibly 1830's for manufacture ?

Steampacket have you got this one listed ?

[TWO TOOTS]

For those of you who prefer their antique flutes fully restored, I believe this chaps tooters are highly regarded.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gerock-flute- ... SwG-1W1B-I

[Steve Bliven]

For those of you who prefer their antique flutes fully restored, I believe this chaps tooters are highly regarded.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gerock-flute- ... SwG-1W1B-I

Pretty, but wouldn't the ring and embouchure material make it difficult, if not impossible, for most international shipping?

Best wishes,

Steve

[jemtheflute]

Serial number looks pretty indistinct. Maybe 2085 ? If so, possibly 1830's for manufacture ?

I agree it's #2085. Probably 1832 by my reckoning, FWTW. Major restoration job on head!

[TWO TOOTS]

Well Steve, that is definitely a point worthy of some consideration. The only tactful way I can respond to your question is to point out that up to and including present times, vendors are still selling these items to the general public Worldwide with International Postage fees displayed. Does this include some element of risk ? I'm sure it must. How significant that element or degree would be, I imagine should have a direct influence on the number of these items being sold on this market. At the moment I see no relevant decrease in the number of these sales................
The other aspect I suppose, is the that albeit a debatable limited opportunity ( for the risk averse ), I'm sure it's one that U.K. forum members may appreciate.

[Steampacket]

Hmm - the rings look similar to the ivory rings on the boxwood Rudall on Ebay:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/English-Boxwo ... SwjVVVp9dU

The barrel has a kind of Sam Murray flare to it, unlike the more familiar barrel shape of R&R 2707 with ivory rings depicted on Terrys page. http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/rudall_Bb.htm.
I wonder if the barrel on R&R 2085 has the Rudall stamp? I see the C# and C keys are missing the square strike plates, perhaps they have the tubes instead?

[TWO TOOTS]

Quite like the look of this Rudall with it's flared barrel and absence of foot plates, coupled with the ivory ferrules, give it a distinctive look in spite of the missing ring and crown. As you mentioned Thomas, I think they used threaded metal inserts to house the C. pewter plugs. Although from an engineering viewpoint I think the metal plates that superceded them seem to be a more robust improvement. As for the crack in the head Jem, I'm sure you've sorted far worse in your time. I've just this minute glued a crack in the head of a lovely 7 key flute made by Geoff Wooff, which does a convincing impression of an aerial view of Owens River in California.
There appears to be another crack in the barrel which looks pretty straight too - all grist for the mill eh?.

[AHFR]

Pretty, but wouldn't the ring and embouchure material make it difficult, if not impossible, for most international shipping?

You are right, Steve, and thanks for pointing this out. I will not attempt to send a flute fitted with ivory outside Europe, and in fact have already refused an offer from America for the Gerock for this reason. I have now amended the eBay advert accordingly.

Thanks!

[TWO TOOTS]

AHFR - Posting the add within the E.U. still gives you another 27 countries to go at while we remain a member, but that's another small factor for our consideration come " The Referendum. " Certainly not an overriding one, but worth a mention I thought.

[Steve Bliven]

Pretty, but wouldn't the ring and embouchure material make it difficult, if not impossible, for most international shipping?

You are right, Steve, and thanks for pointing this out. I will not attempt to send a flute fitted with ivory outside Europe, and in fact have already refused an offer from America for the Gerock for this reason. I have now amended the eBay advert accordingly.

Thanks!

[Major thread drift caution]
The whole ivory ban thing (antique as well as modern) is an unfortunate situation. I assume neither you nor anyone you know killed an elephant back in 1803–1825 to accessorize this flute. I'd just hate to see an instrument like this sitting in a governmental warehouse waiting to be destroyed because there was an attempt to move it across some border. Here in the US, various states are passing or at least discussing laws that would make it illegal to buy/sell or even move ivory across state boundaries. Suddenly museums are faced with having to justify holdings they've had for more than a century. [Turns off rant switch and steps off the soap box].

Best wishes.

Steve

[TWO TOOTS]

Steve Bliven wrote - "[Major thread drift caution]
The whole ivory ban thing (antique as well as modern) is an unfortunate situation. I assume neither you nor anyone you know killed an elephant back in 1803–1825 to accessorize this flute. I'd just hate to see an instrument like this sitting in a governmental warehouse waiting to be destroyed because there was an attempt to move it across some border. Here in the US, various states are passing or at least discussing laws that would make it illegal to buy/sell or even move ivory across state boundaries. Suddenly museums are faced with having to justify holdings they've had for more than a century. [Turns off rant switch and steps off the soap box]."

Could not agree more. Western governments would do better to focus finances and energy protecting the endangered species today. The idea that prohibiting the free movement of antiques around the West will have any impact is frankly laughable, when every man and his dog knows that today's animals are being slaughtered wholesale to fuel the Eastern Worlds market for "Spurious Medicine," and Contemporary Art.
And believe me when I say " They are making a Dog's Breakfast of the futile measures they are trying to enforce, " which is the only ray of sunshine in this whole " Sorry State Of Affairs."

[kkrell]

And believe me when I say " They are making a Dog's Breakfast of the futile measures they are trying to enforce, " which is the only ray of sunshine in this whole " Sorry State Affairs."

In some cases, the Dog IS the Breakfast.

[TWO TOOTS]

Sheesh! Someone got a real bargain there!

[Steampacket]

What do you think of the embouchure hole being so round? Is this usual on Rudalls in the 2000 series? My Rudalls in the 4000-7000 series have oval shaped embouchure holes. I enlarged the head joint photo of 2085 and it looks like the head joint is unlined. Looking in R. Bigio's book "Rudall Rose & Carte" this style of head joint, unlined, and with wide ivory rings seems to be a feature of earlier flutes by John Rose made in the 1820's. I suppose someone could have ordered an "old style" Rudall with unlined head joint and round embouchure hole in the 1830's. The head joint flare resembles that of a Firth & Hall head joint here: http://www.oldflutes.com/american.htm
The C# and C keys don't seem to have any inset tubes for the metal key pads to rest on? Perhaps they have been removed, or fallen out? The Eb tone hole does seem roughly hewn.
I've registered this flute now Two Toots.