Correcting Sharp C#

[Mikethebook]

Just bought an aluminium whistle Low G whistle on eBay, a respected make (not Goldie, MK or Burke) and the equivalent of the C# (all holes uncovered) is VERY sharp. Cnat is fine with OXXOOO but I can't half-hole it. Is there anything I can do to bring the C# down?

[Mr.Gumby]

You can try ooxxxxx or any other combination of fingers down and a bit of shading to bring it down. Or/and ease of the blowing. If that doesn't work you can tape the hole to bring it in but then your Cnat will probably go. Compromises compromises.

[stanton135]

Is there anything inside the bore that shouldn't be there?

[Mr.Gumby]

That would probably flatten it. Which is the way pipers tune their regulators so that may work if all else fails: a blob of blue-tack of appropriate size at the site of the hole (or slightly north) to narrow the bore locally may bring the note in. It may also affect other notes and have other effects but no harm in trying.

[stanton135]

Yeah, it's hard to tell. I'm confused because, IME, if a whistle's C# is out of tune it's flat. I've never seen a whistle with a sharp C#. Plus, if the C# is sharp, I'm also puzzled to hear that OXX OOO is on pitch--it should be sharp too, I would have thought. That's what led me to wonder if there was something odd inside the bore.

How does the C# respond to fingerings such as OXO OOO, OOX OOO, or OOO XXX?

[Angel Shadowsong]

Yeah, it's hard to tell. I'm confused because, IME, if a whistle's C# is out of tune it's flat..

Correct me If I am wrong... but on most flute or whistle the 7th note or ooo-ooo fingering is usually flat around -10 to -20 cents.
And it sounds just right to my ears. I think it is called Just Intonation, which I prefer.

And a flat 7th note is easy to correct by blowing a little harder.

I would prefer a whistle that is flatter than sharper on that area.

I agree on covering the lower 3 holes OOO-XXX.


Atleast you just have one note in sharp. A conical tapered whistle I have has bothering sharpness on the second octave.

[Sirchronique]

Mentioning the make of the whistle might make it easier for people who have experience with that specific whistle type to chime in on the matter.

Also, is it possible that you might be blowing it too hard on that note? Perhaps blowing the C# a bit softer might fix the issue and bring it down to tune.

[benhall.1]

A sound clip might be useful, too.

[syn whistles]

Try tuning the whistle to the C# rather than the D (seriously) and see how the rest of the scale falls then.

[Mikethebook]

Interesting thoughts. Thanks guys. I have a busy day ahead but will consider your ideas and get back to you.

[bogman]

I would tape the c# and overblow for the c natural, if that doesn't work and the rest of the whistle is in tune I'd just throw it away and get one that is.

[bogman]

........you'll probably find a flat c natural easier on the ear than a sharp c#....

[stanton135]

Or, could it be that this is one of the rare whistles that has an in-tune ET C#, and to your ear it sounds sharp because you've been conditioned to a C# that's 20-25 cents flat of ET?

[dspmusik]

i always play C# as ooo oox
how is the intonation on that?
i bought a nice whistle from a maker that i normally like, but this particular whistle had a very sharp (40-50 cents) cross fingered Cnat, which was a deal breaker for me. i do like to 1/2 hole Cnat as often as i can, but there are still plenty of times i use the cross fingered one.
i replaced that whistle with a Burke, and am very happy.

[highwood]

very unusual to have a "very sharp" C# and an in tune cross fingered Cnat (0XX 000) - usually the Cnat tends to be sharp to very sharp with an in tune (ET) C#. So one would expect that a very sharp C# would result in a very, very sharp Cnat perhaps even an almost in tune C#!

There of course may be things going on internally that somehow cause this - in the right (wrong?) place a surprisingly small perturbation to the bore can make a big difference

A recording and/or a brand name would help people help

@dspmusik
as you probably know closing the bottom hole usually makes virtually no difference to pitch to C# or B and many players do it partially to help stabilize the instrument - so 000 00X, X00 00X - even 0XX 00X for A is barely different. But try those fingerings in the second octave...

Getting a usable cross fingered Cnat in my experience making whistles is a matter of tuning the C# flat of ET (I prefer JT anyway) and picking the correct size of holes. I chased getting the perfect Cnat over several iterations of whistle tubes a few years back but gave up (I did get an in tune Cnat but other things did not work). Now I optimize for other things and have ended with a pretty good Cnat after all, funny how things work out!