Which High D?

[Mikethebook]

Nice idea ketida and I've thought about that but I think I need a high D. First, while I'm learning another low whistle with piper's grip may only confuse my muscle memory. A high D is like a different instrument. Second, If I go to classes, it is what I need. You can't fit in with anything else. Third, I want it for playing while at my desk during breaks, something I can just pick up and practice tunes or ornamentation on. Finally, I do like the high D when it's not shrill. Listen to the opening air to The Secret on Roan Inish. It's so haunting and gorgeous and it's on a high D.

[ubizmo]

Although mine eventually broke, I recall the Walton's Little Black Whistle having an oddly quiet 2nd octave. The sound was "thinner" than what I get from other whistles. And it's pretty quiet in the 1st octave too. You should be able to get one for under $10 US.

[MTGuru]

Listen to the opening air to The Secret on Roan Inish. It's so haunting and gorgeous and it's on a high D.

It's also probably EQ'd to a fare-thee-well with the top end rolled off, and compressed/limited like a squashed bug to balance the octaves. Add in some "haunting" reverb and voilà! - the magical whistle that doesn't really exist.

First, while I'm learning another low whistle with piper's grip may only confuse my muscle memory. A high D is like a different instrument.

It shouldn't be. Muscle memory has mostly to do with finger actuation, which is the same regardless of the whistle. High or low, EZ Grip or standard. Thinking of high/low whistles as different instruments is a mistake, IMO. The "low" designation is historical, not functional. They're just whistles in different pitches/keys.

Second, If I go to classes, it is what I need. You can't fit in with anything else.

And for that you'll want a whistle that your instructor can hear properly and which behaves as a normal whistle, so that your instructor can evaluate your playing against a known standard. If you have idiosyncratic hearing tolerances in that setting, then it's really up to you, not everyone else, to adjust. Plus, a quiet whistle won't help your ears when the rest of the class are wailing away.

If you can't tolerate earplugs, then maybe consider over-the-ear headphone type sound mufflers. The kind that construction workers or gun enthusiasts wear. Move them off to hear the instructor, back on to play.

I do wonder, though, why your instructor wouldn't simply allow you to use your low D in the class.

Third, I want it for playing while at my desk during breaks, something I can just pick up and practice tunes or ornamentation on.

For that purpose, a quiet whistle will generally be a breathy whistle, because breathiness is part of what reduces the carrying power. The Parks, Big Whistle "Shush", and muted whistles all work the same way. You can't have perfect tone and inaudibility at the same time.

Something like the Hoover very narrow bore D is voiced with a quiet but clear tone. I also have a Romanian frula with similar voicing, and a very tiny fipple. But these whistles take very, very little breath and I think would still be quite audible in a quiet office setting.

As for breath requirement, it should be more or less proportional to the size of the whistle. If you have a small fipple that takes a big breath, that air has to go somewhere - and it will exit the small window with a breathy sound. Exactly like the Clarke original I described above.

Whistles, like all acoustic instruments, are bundles of physical and acoustical compromises. If you emphasize one characteristic - tone, volume, breath - it will likely be at the expense of other characteristics. Different applications may require different instruments.

And really, I hope all this discussion is helpful.

[Feadoggie]

I was at a whistle workshop a few weeks back and, though I learned some good stuff, the sound of six high whistles playing together did my head in completely and I had a migraine for a couple of days. Trouble is earplugs wouldn't have helped because I needed to hear the soft-spoken instructor in between!

Six whistles! Six, just six!. Try 30 or more at one go.

But seriously, earplugs (or other protection) are the way to go. You're not alone with this particular issue. I know I can't take a room full of high D's anymore myself. My ears basically shut off at some point. Head aches! I can't hear much else for hours afterwards. So I have gone to using earplugs when I go to a workshop. Actually the earplugs are usually in the whistle bag just in case. It is workable. I know others that do the same as well.

Of course with Joanie Madden's classes "the soft-spoken instructor" description might not always apply.

A quiet practice whistle is still a good idea. I just mute a normal D whistle or play using the "whisper method".

Listen to the opening air to The Secret on Roan Inish. It's so haunting and gorgeous and it's on a high D.

The opening theme can also be played on a low A whistle, if that helps you. The same motifs are played on a low D in other parts of the movie. Good movie! Nice music. John Lynch as Tadhg is terrific.

Feadoggie

[MTGuru]

The opening theme can also be played on a low A whistle, if that helps you.

Or a G whistle, since the piece is effectively in G Major. An A whistle puts you in C-nat fingering, which works but with a few half-holed F-nats.

Listen to the opening air to The Secret on Roan Inish. It's so haunting and gorgeous and it's on a high D.

It's also probably EQ'd to a fare-thee-well with the top end rolled off, and compressed/limited like a squashed bug to balance the octaves. Add in some "haunting" reverb and voilà! - the magical whistle that doesn't really exist.

Actually, I realized I have the soundtrack, and just listened to what I guess is the theme in question (track 3). It's not as heavily processed as I guessed, which is a pleasant surprise. The EQ, compression and reverb are fairly light. But the compass is only a 9th, up to E, which makes things easier.

The whistle sounds like a Generation D to me. But who knows.

[Mikethebook]

Yes, it was only six whistles but it was a small room . . . and that's how sensitive I am to noise. I get a migraine/headache at the drop of a hat!! In fact I'm in pain 50% of the time so you can perhaps understand my need to find the right whistle . . . but I have yet to try the muting techniques suggested.

Thanks for your comments MTGuru but I'm still after a high D, a whistle to practice on and attend an occasional class with. By the way, when I said I would be using it at my office desk, I work at home (when I can work) so any sound it makes is not a problem.

I've been wondering about low breath requirements. My experience has been bad when a whistle only needs barely a breath to play its lower notes. But I wonder if, for example, Mack Hoover could make me a quiet whistle with some backpressure whether I would find that easier to play. Air requirements would be low but some push would be needed to get notes. I imagine most of the quiet whistles, Shush etc have no back pressure to speak of.

The Roan Inish track is beautiful, one of the loveliest tunes I've heard on a high D. MTGuru you seem to be the great transcriber on the forum. If you're interested I've made a start on transcribing it but its just a mess of notes so far with questionable time values and I intend to take the bar dividers out. For what it's worth here it is:

X: 1
T:Roan Inish Theme
R: Air
K: Edor
JB2 G2 A2 JF8|JB2 G2 A2 JF4 JG4-!wedge!G4|A4 JF2 G2 JE8|JA4 F2 G2 JE8|JF2 E2 FED
|JB2 G2 A2 JF8|JB2 G2 A2 JF4 G4-!wedge!G4|A4 F2 G2 JE4|G2 A2 B2 {G}A8 |JB2 G2 A2 JF8|G8|
G4 A2 B2 G2 A2| G4 d!wedge!dcBG | G A2 GFG E2| Je4 dcG |ABGA GFG|c4 ded GA
|JBABAGG E4 D4|JG4 d!wedge!dcBG | G A2 GAJB|{G}A GFG |

[MTGuru]

Thanks for your comments MTGuru but I'm still after a high D, a whistle to practice on and attend an occasional class with. By the way, when I said I would be using it at my office desk, I work at home (when I can work) so any sound it makes is not a problem.

Ah then, you have only yourself to torture.

The Roan Inish track is beautiful, one of the loveliest tunes I've heard on a high D. MTGuru you seem to be the great transcriber on the forum. If you're interested I've made a start on transcribing it but its just a mess of notes so far with questionable time values and I intend to take the bar dividers out. For what it's worth here it is:

I'll have a look when I return home later. Meanwhile: It's GMajor/Eminor, not EDor; the C's are natural. And the meter is actually fairly regular if you put the bar lines in the right places.

[Mikethebook]

Ah, yes. I for got to change the key. I usually create a new abc file on top of an old to help me with the notation. I'll be interested to see if you can take it further.

I tried the paper clip mute. It produces a breathy if erratic quietening but I will work with it and see how it goes.

[MTGuru]

I'll be interested to see if you can take it further.

How's this? I put it in 12/8 because I think that best captures the little polyrhythms and hemiolas going on.

X:1
T:Roan Inish Theme, The
C:Mason Daring
S:The Secret of Roan Inish OST - Track 3
Z:MTGuru for C&F, 2012-08-25
M:12/4
K:G
"Freely"JB2G2A2||JF12-|HF6 (B2G2)A2|JF6 {F}JG6-|HG6 A2{E}JF2G2|
{D}JE12-|HE6 {G}J(A2F2G2)|J(E6 JF3E3|H{F=E}D6)|]
"In 4"J(B2G2)A2||JF12-|F6 JB2G2A2|J(F6 {GB}G6-|G6) (A2F2G2)|
JE12-|E6 {FB}G2A2B2|{GA/c/}JA12-|A6 {A}B2G2A2|
JF6- F3-(FG2)-|G6- G3 z2G|-G6- G2A2B2|H{GA/c/}JA12|]
JG3-GDz d3-dc{A}B|{GA}G3-GD2 {G}JA3 z(GF|JG3-GE2) Je3-edc|(G3-GAB) {GB}A3-A(GF|
JG3-G)z2 c3-c(de)|d3-d2(G {Ac}A6)|{Bc}B6 {A}J(B2{cB}A2G2)|G6 (E6|{F=E}D12)|
J(G3-GD2) d3-dcB|{GA}(G3-GDG) {A/c/}JA3 zGA|J{A}B6 {GA/c/}JA3-AGF|{B}(G3-G{AG}FD {E}JF2{BG}F E3-|HE12)|]

BTW, your own start above is not bad at all. You've got the basic melody right.

[Mikethebook]

Wow! Awesome and detailed piece of work. Thanks very much. You're good at this, aren't you?

[Mikethebook]

MTGuru, I'm just working my way through this piece amazed at your speed and hearing. You've got rolls where I never heard them but one query. What is the ornament you have several times on A -fourth line, third bar; third line, fourth bar; and eighth line, third bar?

[Katharine]

You can make an effective whistle "mute" by cutting a narrow strip of card stock (business card), then folding it and placing it in the window of the whistle so that it wraps around the edge of the blade. There are better instructions if you do a quick search. IT might take 45 seconds to make this if you are really slow about it.

You could also buy one of Carey Parks excellent whistles which have a built-in mechanism for quieting the instrument as needed. It's a great instrument even if this wasn't a feature.

ecohawk

Quick hijack, but... how to make this work? I tried this a while back and gave up; no matter how sharply I crease, the cardstock angles at the slant of the blade (we're talking my Walton and Mellow Dog here) and pretty soon it wants to stand at 90 degrees to the whistle itself and then I get no sound at all... should I tape that flappity end down or use a tiny dot of blu-tack under it to anchor it?

[ecohawk]

Actually its better to make it about 1/2 the width of the window more or less depending on how quiet you want it to be. I can't help much further since I've only done it once using my own plain card stock business card and it worked fine for me. It should angle at the same as the blade but mine just stayed there. Sorry I can't help more with this. I love the Parks mute when this is an issue for me.

ecohawk

[MTGuru]

MTGuru, I'm just working my way through this piece amazed at your speed and hearing. You've got rolls where I never heard them but one query. What is the ornament you have several times on A -fourth line, third bar; third line, fourth bar; and eighth line, third bar?

Yeah, that's a hard one to write out, because it's really a combination of 2 ornaments.

It's a G sliding up to A: JA or {G}JA. But in the middle, as you approach the A there's what I call a "flip" (single trill) on the A: {Ac}A. So I wrote it with short graces to show that the {G} is part of the slide but the {Ac} is part of the flip: {GA/c/}JA3

[maki]

You can make an effective whistle "mute" by cutting a narrow strip of card stock (business card), then folding it and placing it in the window of the whistle so that it wraps around the edge of the blade. There are better instructions if you do a quick search. IT might take 45 seconds to make this if you are really slow about it.

You could also buy one of Carey Parks excellent whistles which have a built-in mechanism for quieting the instrument as needed. It's a great instrument even if this wasn't a feature.

ecohawk

Quick hijack, but... how to make this work? I tried this a while back and gave up; no matter how sharply I crease, the cardstock angles at the slant of the blade (we're talking my Walton and Mellow Dog here) and pretty soon it wants to stand at 90 degrees to the whistle itself and then I get no sound at all... should I tape that flappity end down or use a tiny dot of blu-tack under it to anchor it?

My favorite type of mute is card stock cut to fit the whole of the fipple window and then
cut a very deep V in the middle so that some where around half the window is blocked.
This method doesn't allow the card stock to shift about.