"Open" Piping Styles

[ImNotIrish]

Hi folks,

just wondering if someone can steer me toward some examples of the 'open' style of piping. Thanks, Arbo.

[Mr.Gumby]

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=85318

[Hans-Joerg]

I am not too sure whether Johnny Doran could be classified as an "open piper" as you hear a definite stop behind each tone. Portato? What think you?

[Lars Larry Mór Mott]

I am not too sure whether Johnny Doran could be classified as an "open piper" as you hear a definite stop behind each tone. Portato? What think you?

I think Johnny Doran (and Paddy Keenan, Blackie O'Connell, Jörgen Fischer for sure) play a lot of open/chanter off knee rolls and generally 'open' fingering. That said they all can/could play staccato of course, but generally it's more open playing imo

[Mr.Gumby]

I think there are very few, if any, good pipers that play completely open. 'Open style' is by definition a flawed description.

You can hear Ennis, or Clancy, play whole phrases off the knee. Yet nobody would call them 'open' pipers. Both Johnny and Felix Doran used tight triplets and staccato playing. Yet nobody would class the mas 'tight'. It's a matter of degree and above all an easy, and simplistic, pigeon hole.

But we're not going to do that old chestnut again are we?

[Lars Larry Mór Mott]

I think there are very few, if any, good pipers that play completely open. 'Open style' is by definition a flawed description.

You can hear Ennis, or Clancy play whole phrases off the knee. Yet nobody would call them 'open' pipers. It's a matter of degree and above all an easy pigeon hole.

But we're not going to do that old chestnut again are we?

I wasn't aware (though not surprised) this has been up for discussion before.
'open' playing per my definition, is as i said, lots of open rolls, chanter played off knee and 'open' fingering, originating as i understand from the need to be heard when playing outdoors/ at fairs etc in the old days.

[rorybbellows]

I think Johnny Doran (and Paddy Keenan, Blackie O'Connell, Jörgen Fischer for sure) play a lot of open/chanter off knee rolls and generally 'open' fingering. That said they all can/could play staccato of course, but generally it's more open playing imo

The rolling rhythm of these players sets them apart, more then the fingering style.

RORY

[Johnered66]

I though "open" meant rolling along one note to the other with out that distinct piping stop/cut/tight sound. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[PJ]

I though "open" meant rolling along one note to the other with out that distinct piping stop/cut/tight sound. Correct me if I'm wrong.

What you describe is more like "legato" playing. "Open piping" is more than just playing notes "legato".

I heard a good interview with Pat Mitchell in which he says "open piping" is more about tone than technique.

[Johnered66]

Gotcha. Thanks PJ cheers

[MichaelLoos]

Open piping does not mean, playing the chanter like a whistle...
It is more the making extensive use of that little bit of dynamic range which is possible on the pipes.
It actually involves very much staccato playing, but the way of performance is different - instead of playing one staccato triplet every time around the same phrase, you might omit it twice, and the third time, play three triplets in a row, to create a strong effect.
Also, many open pipers tend to use different triplets - for instance, from a tight piper, you will only rarely (if at all) hear back D triplets, or C/B/A, or D/C#/Cnat triplets, which are frequently used by many open players.
If you listen to Paddy Keenan's version of "Harvest Home", you hear plenty of very tight playing, embedded in an otherwise open style, to great effect.
The DVD "Traveller Piper" is IMO a good point to start if you're interested in open style piping.

[Mr.Gumby]

I don't agree with that, the definition of 'open piping' vs 'tight piping' has always been about how the separation of notes is achieved.

One characteristic of the chanter is that it can produce staccato notes, because the piper seals it off at the bottom; with all of the finger holes closed, the chanter is silenced. This is also necessary for obtaining the second octave; the chanter must be closed and the bag pressure increased, and then fingered notes will sound in the second octave. A great range of different timbres can be achieved by varying the fingering of notes and also raising the chanter off the knee, which gives the uilleann pipes a degree of dynamic range not found in other forms of bagpipes. Pipers who use staccato fingering often are termed "closed-style" pipers. Those who use legato fingering more predominately are referred to as "open-style" pipers. Open piping has historical associations with musicians (often Irish travelling people) who played on the street or outdoors, since the open fingering is somewhat louder, especially with the chanter played off-the-knee (which can, however, lead to faulty pitch with the second octave notes).

I reality though few pipers, if any at all, would be exclusively one or the other. I don't think it's helpful to mix 'Traveller (or traveller inspired) style' piping (which is a deeply flawed term in itself to my mind ) with 'open style' as a descriptor.

[MichaelLoos]

I don't agree with that, the definition of 'open piping' vs 'tight piping' has always been about how the separation of notes is achieved.

I didn't say it wasn't... maybe I haven't made clear enough what I wanted to say. "Predominately" is the word that didn't come into my mind.

[Mr.Gumby]

I was still in the process of editing my post above but was interrupted a bit by going to Spanish Point on the school run and looking at the enormous waves the Atlantic is churning up at the minute. It interrupted my train of thought a bit.

Case in point maybe:

Green Gates set

which gives an overall impression of being in a Doran style ( although the playing probably owes in equal measure to Leo Rowsome's influence) in it's immediacy, general wildness and rolling rhythm (not mention the multiple rolling and downward triplet runs) while being from a piper who wouldn't inhabit that bracket most of the time.

[MichaelLoos]

I don't think I've heard this recording before - who is it?
It shows another characteristic I've forgotten to mention - the series of legato triplets (probably what you called "downward triplet runs") which can frequently be heard in the playing of both Dorans as well as in Leo Rowsome's playing.

... a Doran style (although probably more Rowsome-ish in many ways...

Didn't James Ennis dub Rowsome's style as "street piping"... IMO, the Doran and Rowsome styles are closely related.