IMPORTANT - FRED ROSE WHISTLES

nickt · Post by **nickt** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 10:52 am

This is a special message regarding Fred Rose whistles, which many of you love (rightly so!) and many more have ordered.

Fred is now thoroughly snowed under with orders and is working very hard to meet the demand. He is also charging a ridiculously low price for what is probably the best whistle in the world.

Therefore, from 12 Nov 2001, the price will rise from its existing 140 GBPounds to 175 GBPounds (c.$250). This is still too low in my opinion, but Fred is the nicest bloke in the world and he is happy with that. Both Mick Woodruff and I have been telling Fred for some time to raise the price; he now has and has agreed for me to post this thread.

If you have already ordered one, the old price will of course be honoured. Fred will also add a registered post charge (c.20 GBPounds) to ensure delivery (on account of crass lunatics mailing nasty diseases in the post).

Fred has been giving three month lead-times because that's how long it has usually taken him to make a whistle, and he is desperately trying to keep to that (those of you currently waiting will get yours more or less on time - he's aware of Xmas, birthdays, etc). However, from now on the lead-time is six months. Believe me, it will be worth the wait! Next week my Rose blackwood will have its second anniversary party and it will be fun!

I hope you all understand this and why Fred needs to up his price. He was previously making whistles on the side as an extra occupation, but over time the word has got out about his work, and now he is working on them full time and needs reasonable recompense.

Thank you for your consideration with this, and long may the Rose blackwood high D continue!

Best regards
Nick

JessieK · Post by **JessieK** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 11:08 am

I support the price increase.

Jessie

avanutria · Post by **avanutria** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 11:58 am

He hasn't yet responded to my order email. Should I send another? I can't afford the higher price, but if he hasn't acknowledged the email...*worried*

Could someone who is local to Fred Rose call him for me? I can't call overseas..

[ This Message was edited by: avanutria on 2001-10-31 12:59 ]

nickt · Post by **nickt** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 12:28 pm

Avanutria

Mail me on nickturner@hotmail.com with all your details and I make sure Fred gets your order (it'll be at the GBP140 price).

Nick

avanutria · Post by **avanutria** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 12:36 pm

Thanks Nick! I'll do so now.

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 12:47 pm

Nick Wrote:

""....for what is probably the best whistle in the world.""

No way I can agree with that statement. I love the Rose whistle. I absolutely agree that Fred's price is low and he certainly deservers to make more money for his whistles, if he so desires. But best whistle in the world? Simply not true.

First off there is no one whistle that's best for every playing situation. And second, the Rose whistle isn't perfect. The Rose whistle's design causes the second octave D note to be overly sensitive to squeaking unless played oxxxxx, which means some of us have to change or habits to suit the whistle. Many whisltes can played xxxxxx with no problems at all.

Also, the holes on at least two Rose whistles I know of were not drilled precisely in line - the bottom three holes wander a little away from a right handed player, making covering the holes a little less comfortable than a standard whistle. I honestly don't know if this is something Fred has done on purpose, or if it was a mistake, but either way, I find the finger hole position less than ideal.

Fred's whistles haven't been out there too long, so who knows about durability? Only time will tell. Personally, I'm wondering how the Gold plated pieces will hold up.

Finally, I think it takes world class customer service, in addition to a world class product, to earn a title like "Best in the world". Fred still has some work to do in the customer service dept.: He doesn't always return e-mail promptly, or communicate well enough regarding when folks can expect delivery of their instruments, I've had some personal experience with this.

Now I'm really not knocking Fred or his whistles here. Overall, I'm delighted with my Rose whistle, it was certainy worth the wait and price. I believe for most people it would be hard to find a better whistle, delivered more quickly, at a cheaper price....at least if you're looking for a medium to quiet whistle. I still think O'Riordans and Overtons are better whistles when you need more guts and volume. Then you have the whole matter of tone/sound/chiff, some people will love the Rose's pure tone, while others have found it too "recorder like".

Nope, I don't see the Rose or any whistle taking the "Worlds Best Whistle" title any time soon, even if there were such a thing. However, I sure am glad Fred is around making his wounderful Blackwood Gems, and I can't wait till he has some Low Whistles ready for us to enjoy

Loren "Hoping I'm not on Fred's bad side now" B.

[ This Message was edited by: Loren on 2001-10-31 13:51 ]

JessieK · Post by **JessieK** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 1:54 pm

I have spent a bunch of time playing the Rose whistle, and while I agree with Loren that it's sensitive to OXXXXX and that it requires a player to adjust to a slightly different playing technique than say, an Overton or O'Riordan, I have to point out that EVERY different whistle requires a slightly different playing technique, and that with time, I have gotten past the OXXXXX sensitivity and am not experiencing squeaks with that fingering. (Wow, was that a run-on sentence or what?!?) I agree that one whistle cannot have the "best whistle in the world" title because preferences vary, but this whistle certainly is my favorite. I played it in a concert recently and it totally did its job. I was worried it wouldn't be loud enough, but it was.

Jessie

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 5:20 pm

Mmmm, just to be clear Jessie:

I don't have problems with oxxxxx on the Rose, that's rock solid. It's when I play xxxxxx that my Rose get's a bit squeaky.

Did you mean xxxxxx gives you no trouble now? I may have read your message wrong, but it looks like you're saying that with practice oxxxxx gives you no problems. Can you confirm?

Loren "I'm an xxxxxx kind of guy" B.

JessieK · Post by **JessieK** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 6:33 pm

Oops...I meant XXXXXX.

Post by **Dale** » Wed Oct 31, 2001 9:26 pm

Ah, you crazy kids!

XOXOXOX,

Love,

Dale

nickt · Post by **nickt** » Thu Nov 01, 2001 5:37 am

I said "probably the best whistle in the world", not "THE best"...that gives an out! For me it is, but that's a subjective view, I fully appreciate others may hold a different view, and I apologise if that comment came across the wrong way.

The XXXXXX mentioned has not been a problem for me - it needs attention on breath control, but in truth I am an OXXXXX man.

Regarding Fred's customer service, he would probably be the first to concur. But take a look at his situation: he's a music teacher and musician (an accomplished violinist, guitarist, flautist and whistler) who was making excellent whistles on the side. Over the past six months, thanks to Mick Woodruff and myself waxing lyrically about his whistles, he is now full time whistle-making with no spare time left (and at less than the National Minimum Wage at the current price - hence the increase for 12 Nov). Things like computers, internet, and so on are another world. He's at home with lathes and reamers and wood dust, and does his best with the service side, but has very little time left.

Which is why I have got involved to help him out, and I'm happy to do it for him as a friend, not least because he really is one of the nicest blokes on the planet.

Regarding the gold plate - I spoke to Fred about this when I visited him two weeks ago. My blackwood is 2y old and as new; Fred has whistles a lot older and also still as new, so I do not think there will be a problem here. However, we discussed silver ferrules and Fred will probably change to these as soon as he can locate a tube maker who can make silver tubing (and/or solid gold tubing) to thousandths of an inch precision (not so easy, though Chris Abell obviously has found one).

Finally, Fred is a perfectionist, so if your whistle isn't quite right (the XXXXXX and the hole alignment), send it to Fred and he will sort it.

I hope that's all clear! If anyone wants to mail me direct to discuss Fred's whistles further rather than use a public forum, my address is: nickturner@hotmail.com

Best wishes
Nick

StevePower · Post by **StevePower** » Thu Nov 01, 2001 5:18 pm

On 2001-10-31 13:47, Loren wrote:
""....for what is probably the best whistle in the world.""
No way I can agree with that statement.

Well, technically, Loren, you can't disagree with the statement either, because of the qualifier in the sentence (the word 'probably').

Did the famous Carlsberg lager adverts get shown in the states? The ones with that catchy slogan? They certainly would not have been allowed on UK TV if the slogan had run: 'Carlsberg - The Best Lager in the World!'. They would not have been allowed to make a statement that implied superiority over another product, but which could not be substantiated, verified or proven legally. And as taste is largely a subjective issue, there is no way that would happen. Carlsberg not only got around the problem, but also invented one of the world's catchiest slogan's (probably) by the use of the qualifing statement: Carlesberg - Probably the best lager in the world! It's a subjective statement and one that does not suggest an absolute truth - and therefore is not one that can be challenged.

Steve Power
probably the friendliest whistle dealer in the world

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Thu Nov 01, 2001 7:25 pm

(Shaking head) Steve, Steve, Steve......Try to remember man, you're not a real Lawyer, you just play one in your mind.

And, technically speaking, I actually did disagree with and challange the "Probably best in the world" statement, regardless of your theory that it's not technically possible to do so - Fact is I did it. Your hypothesis fails I'm afraid.

That's the funny thing about reality Steve, it doesn't get bogged down so much with those pesky legal technicalities you find so vexing.

Now tell me Steve, why do you insist on taunting me when I've gone out of my way to bury the hatchett with you in recent months? I thought we had an understanding, truce, remember?

I've been more than reasonable in trying to be civil to you and avoid conflict recently, but I've reached my limit now, so fair warning: Next time the gloves come off......

Loren

[ This Message was edited by: Loren on 2001-11-01 20:27 ]

Bretton · Post by **Bretton** » Thu Nov 01, 2001 8:57 pm

There must be sub-plots at work here that I know nothing about... that, or you guys are just way too sensitive and/or paranoid.

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Thu Nov 01, 2001 9:03 pm

Oh yeah, there's some history here Brett.......