B flat chanter problems

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FlaminGalah
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B flat chanter problems

Post by FlaminGalah »

Hello all,

I have a B flat chanter with two tuning issues I am looking to correct.

I will use “concert pitch” names for notes, but understand that these are of course transposed.

1) I have been completely unable to find any combination of fingering to give C natural. Every different fingering gives an insufficiently flat C#. There is a Cnat key but this is inconvenient for some tunes.

2) the hard D is very sharp, and can only brought down to almost pitch (still sharp) with the bottom of the bore almost completely filled with [blutack, rushes, other crap], to the point of poor intonation.

Would appreciate any thoughts on how to correct these!

Thanks,
FG
geoff wooff
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by geoff wooff »

Could it be that your reed head speed is too high ?
Do you get any auto cran problems ?
What is the overal length of the chanter and what pitch is it currently playing at ( ie how flat or sharp of modern Bb) ?
FlaminGalah
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by FlaminGalah »

Thanks Geoff.

It’s all playing quite flat relative to concert Bb: hard “D” is A+45 (with all the junk in the bell), high “D” is A+17, and “A” is E-5.

Chanter length is about 473mm, reed is 86.5mm long, 11mm wide at head, seated 14mm deep in the reed seat.

And yes, when I take the junk out of the bell it auto-crans magnificently. Like a gargling goose.

Cheers,
FG
geoff wooff
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by geoff wooff »

Hmmm,
quite a conundrum !!
That is one long chanter .....
When you draw air through the reed, by sucking steadily on the staple end, what note is emitted ?
FlaminGalah
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by FlaminGalah »

That was with the reed-seat tenon- length without tenon is 440mm, though I am sure the full length is the important one.

The reed crows right around G5, maybe as much as 25 cents flat of that, depending on suction.

It does seem a long, flat chanter, though I can get the drones that low so just being in tune with itself would be a good start!

Thanks again for your help!
geoff wooff
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by geoff wooff »

I would expect the 'crow' to be a bit lower in pitch... usually about the A note of the chanter, so in this case perhaps about a modern F or a little lower. Try a reed scraped more at the binding end to lower its pitch. remove all debris from the bell of the chanter and see if you can get the hard D to sound without auto cran.... then perhaps it will be possible to line things up but it is a difficult analysis without the stick in one's hands.
What dimensions are the staple ?
FlaminGalah
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by FlaminGalah »

Thanks! I’ll give it a try tomorrow and see how I make out.
Will report back.
Many thanks again.
A
FlaminGalah
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by FlaminGalah »

Staple is 3.5mm internal diameter.

I’ve scrapes a reed down (a lot) to sound around F and this has vastly improved the autocran - all the stuff out of the bell now and usually sounding a fair hard “D”.

Tuning is now:
Hard D - Bb-30
High D - A-30
A - E-30.

The whole chanter is more or less 80c flat of nominal Bb except the bottom “D” and “E” which are only 30c flat of Bb scale.

I continue to be great full for all the excellent advice!!
geoff wooff
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by geoff wooff »

That looks like an improvement FG ,
and suggests that much of the problem is the reed.
Try some further alterations :
Experiment with narrowing the staple with a wire 'rush'.

Make a narrower staple, or at least make one with the eye closed more, this will raise the pitch of the upper hand notes , esp. back D.

Make a narrower headed reed.... down towards 10mm width , or beyond.
See what works for you and try to get a situation where the minimum of chanter rushing is involved.

After exhausting the reed possibilities one might look at the chanter.
FlaminGalah
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by FlaminGalah »

Extremely helpful, Geoff, thank you!

I’ll start working through these solutions.

Cheers
FG
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Christian Tietje
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Re: B flat chanter problems

Post by Christian Tietje »

Hi FlaminGalah,
my experience (after about 40 years of reedmaking and tuning):

1. Check the size of the reed. Lenght, width at the tip, diameter of staple, opening of the eye. Mainly: is it the correct lenght for this chanter? I assume that your pipe maker once tuned it correctly. With an incorrect lenght it will never be good.
2. Tune the chanter to low A. Ignore for the moment the bottom D and the back D. If the A is good you can work further on. If the A is good the G will be a little bit sharp - theoretically about 4 cents tuned to an equal tuning scale. While playing you should than flaten the G by right hand 2nd finger down (espcially in airs and at the end of G-tunes).
3. If then the back D is flat it seems that your reed is too long. If it is sharp, it is too short. The latter is easily to manage by wax in the upper half of the hole (or tape, or screw, if your chanter has one).
4. If the bottom D is flat after my opinion the reed is too much open at the tip/eye of the reed or too hard, too stiff.
5. If C-natural is sharp or is a C# the reed is too hard. Soften by scraping at the sides of the reed beginning at the bridle scraping with a blade down to the tip but not further down as about 4-5 mm to the tip. If the reed plays easily never scrape at the heart of the reed!
6. I the bottom D is sharp or the hard bottom D comes no good a piece of plastic of about 2-4 mm width as an upside down V into the end should help, try a little bit.

After that procedure please report :-)
Christian Tietje
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