Elder Reeds

[tommykleen]

If you are introducing exotics into your part of the world make sure you are not importing an aggressive invader that may wreck havoc with native plant species and native plant communities. Even if you are bringing in a species that is known to be non aggressive, one should stiill be aware of causing genetic drift in some indigenous plant populations which may already be vulnerable due to a variety of other factors.

Here endeth the lesson.

On the upside, I have not been able to find that S. nigra poses much of a threat anywhere in the US. Worth a second look though.

t

[dean]

I just looked this up, Sambucus nigra is a (US) zone-5 hardy plant. If you are in that East-West strip of middle, middle America then you may already have some in your region or your local plant providers may have / can get specimens for you. It is possible that your county extension or other agricultural offices might be able to point you to existing samples.

I have been wondering what to put in my yard this year after a major tear-out last year. Maybe I'll put in elder. They are supposed to heve nice flowers and berries. lol, ok Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sambucus_nigra) has a confusing entry. It says under "Uses": The berries are edible after cooking, but all other parts of the plant are POISONOUS, containing toxic calcium oxalate crystals. It then says: Stembark, leaves, flowers, fruits, root extracts are used to treat bronchitis, cough, upper respiratory cold infections, fever.

cheers,
Dean...K...

[Nanohedron]

Weird about the medical uses. I've come across stories of pigs dying from eating elder roots.

If I understand correctly, the wood is pretty nil for any concern when it comes to toxins. Bark, leaves, roots and seeds can be hazardous, but they're of no immediate interest to the piper, anyway.

[tommykleen]

Weird about the medical uses. I've come across stories of pigs dying from eating elder roots.

If I understand correctly, the wood is pretty nil for any concern when it comes to toxins. Bark, leaves, roots and seeds can be hazardous, but they're of no immediate interest to the piper, anyway.

Here's the deal: S. canadenses http://wisplants.uwsp.edu/scripts/detai ... SAMCANvCAN
is the dark-berried species common in the Eastern US and has many edible properties. Just ask Euel Gibbons. S. pubens or Red Elderberry, ihttp://wisplants.uwsp.edu/scripts/detail.asp?SpCode=SAMRACsPUBvP is toxic, or at least, hazardous.

[sean an piobaire]

Thanks Pipewort for the safety warning!
The dust of Cane (Arundo donax)isn't very good for you either,
with all it's silica !
Over many years, the West Coast lumber industry has cut
down a lot of Elder as "cull wood" that is, any wood that is
"non-commercial" or has no value to the forest products industry.
The flowers of Elder are used in the herbal tea and there's
many herbal remedies that use Elder... consult your "herbals".
I have the one by Dover books, I bought it in the 1970s.
Please wear a dust mask when you make those reeds !
Sean Folsom

[Pipewort]

May be because I am on a diet I forgot to say that the flowers make two great dishes in there own way. Dipped in a light batter and deep fried and then dusted in sugar. And when added (in a muslin bag) to the stewing gooseberry's for goosberry jam. The latter has a heady scent of white wine flavour.

Both can be enjoyed as a reward for a good days work at the reed making table.

Pwt

[Kevin L. Rietmann]

Please wear a dust mask when you make those reeds !

Will do. I'll cut a hole for my pipe stem...

Hack Cough! Actually Sean ain't just a-woofin', to quote Elvis. Elder dust is the nastiest shhtchuff. Cane dust is like potpourri in comparision.
Consulted my copy of the Alaskan Bootlegger's Bible, and in re: elderberry wine, he warns:

Caution: Do not use native Alaskan wild elderberries! Sambucus racemosa - Pubens. They are inedible, toxic and cause nausea, diarrhea, or worse. Use only domesticated "Lower-48" elderberries."

Since the author is an ex-Green Beret who makes hooch out of discarded bleach bottles, I'd say don't chew on those leaves. But here is some contrasting info from paghat.com, whoever they are.

The clusters of drupes are believed by many people to be toxic, but they are not toxic when fully ripened, not even if eaten raw, unless you chew up the seeds. The rest of the plant is toxic; the roots, flowers, seeds, & leaves, as well as the fruit's pulp while still green, possesses cyanide-producing glycosides. Medicinal teas made from the leaves can be dangerous & are definitely not recommendable, not that that keeps people from trying it.

The berries include the toxin while green because this permits the plant to finish producing its seeds before the berries get harvested by wildlife. It then becomes safely eaten so that its indigestible seeds will be dispersed in the poops of bears & birds & most wildlife which is happy to eat the bright red summer fruit.

If people cannot eat them raw, it's because they taste unpleasant enough to cause a bellyache. However, cooked, with the seeds strained out of it, & spiced, they make an excellent tangy jelly. Elderberry wine is an old American favorite from days gone by. The "First Peoples" here in the Northwest prized the berries, saving them for winter use, preserved in bear-grease, or dried & pounded into cakes mixed with sweeter berries, most especially with huckleberries.

I'm curious why the Bootlegger's Bible guy considers Sam racemosa native only to Alaska, too - it's actually native to most of the West coast. Probably a few toasted brain cells from all that bleach. I use Red Elder for reeds and haven't ever had any blisters cold sores etc. etc.

[maki]

[THREAD REVIVAL - MOD]

Please forgive the necro-posting.
Anyone have any currently availible articles on elderberry reeds?
None of the links seem to work.

Soooooo, couple of questions for reed gurus.
Does Sambucas mexicana work the same as the Eruo/East coast(Sambucus nigra) variety?
If so, I believe now is the time to harvest.
What size of branch is the standard for chanter reeds?
I happen to have planted a tree in my back yard and it needs prunning.
Any and all advice? Thanks.

I did read that they sould be seasoned for over a year.
Would anyone be interested in having a go at them once dried?
These trees are really common in SoCal, though not as common as the invasive weed that is giant reed-Arundo donax.