What percentage of pipers play flat sets?

[PJ]

Does anyone play a C chanter against a set of concert D drones? I've heard that creates an unusual but not unpleasant effect.

I've tried it but even with a relatively loud C chanter, the D drones drown it out.

If you want to hear what it sounds like, have a listen to Liam O'Flynn playing the Humours of Barrack Street (about 30 seconds into Timedance).

[KAD]

I play in D at sessions around here, and opted for C as a flat pitch because that's what my slightly-more-distant friends who play flat sets have. Also the stretch on some B sets is tough for me.

C chanter against D drones would be really nice for D minor tunes, or for playing what would be E minor tunes on a C set. But otherwise...? C drones are so wonderful, why else would you turn them off?

KAD

[The Sporting Pitchfork]

Does anyone play a C chanter against a set of concert D drones? I've heard that creates an unusual but not unpleasant effect.

I've tried it but even with a relatively loud C chanter, the D drones drown it out.

If you want to hear what it sounds like, have a listen to Liam O'Flynn playing the Humours of Barrack Street (about 30 seconds into Timedance).

I'm probably not the only one on here who put that record on the turntable, listened to the first few seconds and thought, "Wow, I didn't know they made pipes pitched THAT low", and then realized that it was a 45 rpm EP...

[PJ]

You better explain the terms "record", "turntable" and "45 rpm" for the benefit of the younger forum members ...

[SRHill]

As long as were on the topic- I was wondering if it were possible to play C regs with a D chanter. The reason I ask is that on Ronan Oliviers website, he makes C/D convertible drones in which if you order say a 3/4 C set with convertible drones and have both C and D chanters you have in essence a 3/4 C set and 1/2 D set. Anyway, if your playing it as a 1/2 D set, would the C regs be useless or do you have any note/chord possibilites to use on occasion?

[tommykleen]

As long as were on the topic- I was wondering if it were possible to play C regs with a D chanter. The reason I ask is that on Ronan Oliviers website, he makes C/D convertible drones in which if you order say a 3/4 C set with convertible drones and have both C and D chanters you have in essence a 3/4 C set and 1/2 D set. Anyway, if your playing it as a 1/2 D set, would the C regs be useless or do you have any note/chord possibilites to use on occasion?

You can make some very spooky music with this combo. Just in time for Halloween!

t

[mallin]

I've read that Tim Britton makes his concert drones able to tune down to C. Anyone heard them? Are Britton and Oliviers the only makers doing this? Do they pass the 'sweetness' test?

PS. Sorry about the POLL/numerical confusion. I think this could still be turned into a POLL with three options, if anyone's still interested. (Actually I asked this same question over at http://uilleannforum.com/forums/viewtop ... f=2&t=1996 and someone turned it into a POLL).

[Steve Turner]

You can make some very spooky music with this combo. Just in time for Halloween!

Indeed! I tried this today using my new David Lim C chanter, and my D drones. It sounds like you're automatically playing in a minor key. The E on the chanter (which is actually D on a C chanter) blends with the drones, and playing the bottom D (actually C) gives the music a haunting Eastern European sound...very strange and unusual, but not at all unmusical.

Steve

[rorybbellows]

The crux of the biscuit is how the chanter is tuned. When a concert pitch chanter is tuned to D drones correctly the A note is 2 cent sharp and the B is 16 cent flat. The same can be said for a C chanter correctly tuned to C drones, but the B note on a C chanter is actually A, so when you play B on a C chanter against D drones you will be 18 cent out of tune.

RORY

[Driftwood]

when you play B on a C chanter against D drones you will be 18 cent out of tune.

Yep. Something like that, in theory. This is analogous to using E drones with a D chanter, which is something I do on a regular basis. I think it works (but if I posted a sound clip for others to judge you wouldn't know where the poor pipering finished and any inadequacies in the set-up began.....)

What I tend to do is tune the E drone slightly flat (using the slightly flat upper octave e). I'm also helped by the fact that the "normal" fingered b on my chanter is slightly sharp. This brings the e - b 5th interval a bit more in tune. Having said all that I wouldn't be surprised if there still weren't some intonation problems.

So maybe I have just got used to hearing those one or two "e minor" tunes sounding a particular way when I play them. I've read that keyboard players in the pre-equal temperment days realised that a tune played in C sounded different to the same tune played in B, and just accepted that difference in character.

IMO another caveat to the use of E drones is that suitable tunes are not all that easy to come by.

[PJ]

when you play B on a C chanter against D drones you will be 18 cent out of tune.

Yep. Something like that, in theory.

Well, Liam O'Flynn makes it work, so that puts pay to the 'theory'.

[rorybbellows]

when you play B on a C chanter against D drones you will be 18 cent out of tune.

Yep. Something like that, in theory.

Well, Liam O'Flynn makes it work, so that puts pay to the 'theory'.

Try reading my post in its entirety( a few times).I said, when chanters are tuned to drones, meaning just intonation, meaning non-transposable. So for Liam O'Flynn to make it work had to tune his chanter away from D drones .

RORY

[mallin]

So for Liam O'Flynn to make it work had to tune his chanter away from D drones .
RORY

But if I follow correctly, that'd be difficult to do with notes like B that were too flat against the drones. Taking the C chanter against D drones example, the 'B' is 16 cents flatter than equal temperament, where it is now supposed to be 2 cents sharper (like an 'A') . How would one sharpen those notes, aside from permanently opening up the tone-holes? (Flattening is easy, with tape etc.)

[Driftwood]

But if I follow correctly, that'd be difficult to do with notes like B that were too flat against the drones. Taking the C chanter against D drones example, the 'B' is 16 cents flatter than equal temperament, where it is now supposed to be 2 cents sharper (like an 'A') . How would one sharpen those notes, aside from permanently opening up the tone-holes? (Flattening is easy, with tape etc.)

You tune the drone down towards the flatter notes (B & F#) and then you can tape the sharper notes or use alternative fingering / shading.

[mallin]

Ah, so C minus a few cents... or chanter reed adjustments to bring the flattest notes up to C concert pitch and then tape the sharp ones.