Geoff Wooff C# Chanter

bradhurley · Post by **bradhurley** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 1:39 pm

Really, though, these prices on eBay are getting the attention of instrument makers. On the flute side, Patrick Olwell is selling his remaining stock of bamboo flutes only on eBay because he consistently gets three times his normal asking price that way. A secondhand keyless wooden flute made by Chris Wilkes recently fetched more than US $3,000 on eBay, also close to three times the price you'd pay for one new.

If you were a pipemaker, how would you feel if you knew that the person you just sold a set to could turn around tomorrow and sell it for several times what you were just paid? Issues of integrity, ethics, and concern for the future of piping aside, it would make business sense for makers to cancel all their orders, return their deposits, and sell only via eBay. I don't think that will happen, but it's a crazy situation.

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 2:09 pm

daveboling wrote:
Peter Laban wrote:You cetainly get your chanter cheaper directly from the maker
If you can stand the 10+ year wait. Maybe the bidders really do believe that time (less of it) is worth the money.

dave boling

glands · Post by **glands** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 2:18 pm

Double that sterling figure to get the figure in US Dollars. I hope the stick works. I'm not saying that its too much money but it is a lot for a stick sans original chanter top.

Piobairi Uilleann Inis Fa · Mon Sep 25, 2006 2:52 pm

glands wrote:Double that sterling figure to get the figure in US Dollars. I hope the stick works. I'm not saying that its too much money but it is a lot for a stick sans original chanter top.

This is "Leo" league pricing without extrapolating for the value of a fully original chanter top. I am glad that the interest is still strong though, as I thought perhaps there was some weakening over the past year which could reflect on the levels of interest. Perhaps if there is any weakening, it is only occuring at the second tier and below. You don't find many K&Q, Woof, Fromment or Williams sets out there for sale (though we keep looking), and even more rare are the Rowesome, Egans, Taylors, Coynes and Harrington's. Like everything else, the real art work never looses its value, but the wannabees and newbees (relative to the list of living and deceased makers above) are up and down with the market (some maker's sets are selling for less than cost in secondary markets now). No offense to any makers intended.

Neil

Patrick D'Arcy · Post by **Patrick D'Arcy** » Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:34 pm

Wow!

PD.

billh · Post by **billh** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 2:54 am

Actually it isn't such an outrageous price if you think about it. It is after all a narrow bore five key chanter from a top maker, with an egan style stop key. (Thinking in Euro for a moment) Let's consider the price of such an animal new:

€1000 is not atypical for a top maker's chanter with one key and a timber reed cap. I know from experience that the Egan style stop keys are time consuming to make, it would be fair to add €200... makers may charge €100 for additional keys... so that's as much as €1600 or more for the chanter. Bag and bellows from CJ Dixon would cost $460 which is about €350, bringing us to a total of just under €2000.

The Ebay price is equivalent to about €2600. Even if you consider that the extra €600 is based on the value of the chanter, it represents less than a 50% increase over a "reasonable" new price for the same item (which as we know is not readily available - I think this may be the C# that Geoff sold that wasn't part of a set).

Even if makers were getting €2200 for chanters like this (1600+600), they wouldn't be getting rich if they were spending as much time on each one as Geoff does...

regards,

Bill

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Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 2:59 am

A new Wooff chanter is @ 1500 euro. The one on e-bay was only a chanter with the rest of the lot by someone else. The chanter I got a few months ago is in ebony, fully keyed, reedcap made by the maker himself and mammoth ivory mounted. And with a superb reed. But they will only make you sound better if you can actually play them well.The wait wasn't too bad

I have had an unkeyed unreeded C sharp hanging on the wall for the past twelve years or so, price levels are reaching the tempting level

billh · Post by **billh** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 3:06 am

Peter Laban wrote:A new Wooff chanter is @ 1500 euro, the one I got was in ebony, fully keyed, reedcap made by the maker himself and mammoth ivory mounted. And with a superb reed. But they will only make you sound better if you can actually play them well.The wait wasn't too bad

Right: a five month wait and twenty years of friendship. Possibly not germane to this discussion

OK, if we take €1500 as the "direct from the maker" price, the eBay purchaser paid a €700 premium, still under 50%. (Since Chris B. has been making the Egan style reed caps for a long time I think it best to assume for our purposes that the reed cap is functionally equivalent to Geoff's).

Not a huge premium under the circumstances. I would think that the lack of a "makers warranty" so to speak would be a bigger concern. But I can see why someone would want to take that chance, given the pedigree of the instrument.

Bill

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 3:10 am

billh wrote: Right: a five month wait and twenty years of friendship. Possibly not germane to this discussion

Bill

Yes but three other chanters were delivered at the same time to other players at the same price level and that IS relevant eventhough there's still an element of 'who's asking'. And fair enough, I got the left over ivory as a bonus.

Jim McGuire · Post by **Jim McGuire** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 3:15 am

If it was a practice set sale, then maybe a Heather Clarke tutor should have been thrown in there, too.

billh · Post by **billh** » Tue Sep 26, 2006 4:26 am

Jim McGuire wrote:If it was a practice set sale, then maybe a Heather Clarke tutor should have been thrown in there, too.

Like everyone else I fully expect the pieces of this sale to be "parted out" afterwards. That's why I considered the chanter (plus cap) separately from the bag+bellows when trying to assess the current market price of the components "new".

Steampacket · Post by **Steampacket** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:11 am

I paid 1.000 USD for my Wooff C, unreeded with original Wooff windcap in November 2001. I was offered a Froment windcap but declined as I wanted the complete instrument to be original. Geoff sent a couple of reeds from Ireland and at Willie Week 2002 I gave the chanter to Geoff and he made a reed which really sang and is still getting better in spite of three Swedish cold and dry winters. It's a fine and inspiring instrument to play. Seems to respond better the more it's played.

From the seller of my chanter back in nov, 2001:

"The chanter is as it left Geoffs workshop. The bore is effectively the Harrington, with Geofs design of thickening the outside of chanter at the low E to improve the octave seperation. I'm looking for offers above $US750 - I already have a firm of $US800 from one party. I have about 15 people emailing me regarding offers right now. I was originally including a Froment stainless head, with no stop key."

So 5 years on and a Wooff C# chanter goes for over 3.000 USD. Well it's a quality instrument and the price isn't at all outrageous when compared to the price of any other quality instrument such as a violin, guitar, oboe, saxophone etc. A Chris Wilkes keyless went for 3.349 USD recently. Like Geoff Chris makes a few instruments a year, has a long waiting list so the few instruments that come up for sale are sought after.

tompipes · Post by **tompipes** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:16 am

Just thought I'd throw in my 2p worth.
I'll agree with Bill and most others here and say that it's not nuts to spend this kind of money on this kind of instrument.
I've no doubt that CJ's bag and bellows are of fine quality. One only has to look on his website to get the feeling that he cares about what he makes.
Unfortunatly, and no disrespect to you CJ, the bag and bellas (as dey say in dubalin) could have been made by God himself and it would have mattered. It was a Woof chanter that was for sale and the winner got a free baganbellas.
Personally I like playing with other people so C# for me is about as useful as a handbrake in a canoe. Don't even bother trying to change my mind. It'd be easier to get Royce to buy a narrow bore D chanter.

Actually I think C# is a mistake. Woops, did I say that out loud...

I have had an unkeyed unreeded C sharp hanging on the wall for the past twelve years or so, price levels are reaching the tempting level

I'll give you a fiver.... and I'll get some other lad to ream the shight out of it....

Only coddin.

Tommy

Joseph E. Smith · Post by **Joseph E. Smith** » Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:25 am

It's just me, but if I'm going to lay out the kind of clams that this chanter is selling for, I'd prefer it to be 100% the (... one) maker's work... in this case, the esteemed Mr. Wooff.

Whilst the cap in question is of unquestionably good construction and is pleasing esthetically, it does not quite match the chanter. This would irritate the pants off the compulsive neurotic in me.

Oddly enough, if the chanter I play does not match the body of the pipes, I have no issues... go figure.

PJ · Post by PJ » Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:41 am

Joseph E. Smith wrote:It's just me, but if I'm going to lay out the kind of clams that this chanter is selling for, I'd prefer it to be 100% the (... one) maker's work...

Hey JES,

What about your B chanter. You know, the one with the body by Kennedy and the mounts and WINDCAP by Boisvert?