What would you expect a wider chanter reed to do?

[bobkeenan]

I tried to replicate my favorite reed (one I made that I modeled after my best brad angus reed). Same reed cane, about the same staple size, same sanding block, all same dimensions, similar scrap thicknesses. But I ended up with a wider reed. 13 versus 11.9 mm. Did that on purpose to see what a wider reed would do. I also rubbed a little beeswax on the inside of the slip and brushed it out with steel wool. That was different too? and I shaved the tail in deeper a bit at the start to accommodate a wider reed.

SO..... What would you expect would be the difference with a wider reed?

what I have noticed is that it plays softer. I can open the reed with the bridle to sound louder but its still on the soft side. I kind of like the sound. I am assuming the extra width did it but its probably one of the dozen other variables that I think are the same my favorite reed but really are not.

On a related question.... Has anyone been anal enough to keep constant all the variables in reed making and then just change one of them to different sizes. Then repeated that but another variable. Like make a reed that plays well and then with the same reeds try several staples with differing eye heights. Or use one staple and try different reed widths, etc.

[CHasR]

Alls' I have to say is: on a normal double-reed, a wider head means its louder & flatter. Just goes to show how "one-off" UP chanter reeds *really* are, in the grand scheme of universal reeding. A sacrifice made to gain the altissimo register, I suppose.

[benwalker]

I once just for fun made a ridiculously wide chanter reed.. I think it was after seeing on of Paddy Keenan's reeds... It sounded very flat and even though the tone was rather pleasant the tuning was horrendous in the second octave

[Brazenkane]

SO..... What would you expect would be the difference with a wider reed?

It depends on if it's long, or short. Where the bridle is, and how the scrape is.

what I have noticed is that it plays softer. I can open the reed with the bridle to sound louder but its still on the soft side. I kind of like the sound. I am assuming the extra width did it but its probably one of the dozen other variables that I think are the same my favorite reed but really are not.

Very difficult to assume anything unless you've built it that same way over and over, and did not change anything (to the best of your ability. ONly then can you come up with an idea of what's up. (emphasis on "idea").

On a related question.... Has anyone been anal enough to keep constant all the variables in reed making and then just change one of them to different sizes.

Of course, yes.

Then repeated that but another variable. Like make a reed that plays well and then with the same reeds try several staples with differing eye heights. Or use one staple and try different reed widths, etc.

Differing eye heights will affect the head, so all bets are off. Same staple and diff. widths, again simply by the virtue of the heads being different, all bets are off.

If there was a "very best reed maker," and he/she did a head transplant onto a flawless copy of the 1st staple , there's a high likelihood that the head would sound, or perform differently on the 2nd staple.

Simply, no 2 pieces of cane are the same, and it is this fact that always will throw a wrench into trying to pin things down absolutely. Also, how and where the cane settles on the staple, directly affects the head's performance, or lack or lack thereof.

I feel the best we can do is use a method that generally produces fewer failures. It's a tough place to arrive at, and from the very start...one needs a good source of consistent cane that will afford the breadth and width to be able to hook up all the "numbers."

[uilleannfinlander]

Liam O'Flynn reed dimensions ..
http://www.hartdd.com/reed/view.asp?search=366

[ttoberer]

I posted something about this years ago on this forum and was just thinking about it again. big reeds, small reeds There is another set of dimensions of Liam O'flynns reed as measured by David Quinn, that I copied from David Dayes website years ago. Interestingly the dimensions are completely different. Either the measurements are wrong or these are two different reeds. Apparently this reed has been playing for over 40 years (maybe 50 now) and we all know it is about the most lovely sounding thing anyone has ever heard.
The width from Pat Sky is 15.07mm and the width from David Quinn is (a much more believable) 13.4mm. The total length from Sky is 85.65 the length and from Quinn 85.5
The staple from Sky is a little less than 2 1/4" and Quinn has it at 2 1/4"
Here is a question for and expert reedmaker. Is it true that when the dimensions get larger, the tolerances go down making the recipe more forgiving? This would make sense in terms of chanter geometry considering the larger parts of the bore are less sensitive to changes in diameter than the narrow constricted parts of the bore. This would also partially explain why narrow bore D chanters are a bear to put a reed into! Anything that makes reedmaking easier is a good thing. I am just getting back into reedmaking after a 6 year hiatus from the pipes (in fluteland) and may experiment with this again , but the head width of 15.07 sounds reediculous! These wide reeds typically seem to have a high bridle placement (reducing inner volume sharpening pitch maybe) Another thing Im considering is these probably wont work with tubing staples. Can anyone else add anything to this matter???

[tompipes]

Big reeds!

I've made reeds for 'copies' of Liams Rowsome chanter but I must say that I don't know how faithful the copies were. The OAL, throat and bell were consistent with Rowsomes work from that era but that's all I measured at the time.

Anyway, I never had to go over 13mm wide head or 81.5mm long. Wide reed heads may be one way of getting sharp chanters down to 440 but because you have a reed with a wide surface area you now have a reed that's more prone to react with weather changes.

There are other ways of flattening reeds rather than making shovels!


Tommy

[allan moller]

a wider reed head will flatten the pitch overall sometimes useful when dealing with flat upper octaves often combined with a rush.however i have found that once you start to make 13mm plus heads and beyond to a length of 84mm you have to shorten the scrape and put the bridle higher up to sharpen the reed which seems a waste of time,it also makes for a duller and less harmonically rich tone.most of those old chanters that took "shovel"reeds can be fitted with a 52mm staple,13mm head width and about 82mm long with the bridle at the base of the reed and a long scrape thereby giving you a trade off by flattening a sharper reed which has a greater speaking area of cane to brighten the tone.good luck,allan.