Embouchure help: I'm playing too flat

[Cyberknight]

I also have a chronic problem with playing too flat on any and every of the direct-blown wind instruments I’ve used. I compensated for it in the hardware when I was a kid (extra short barrel on my clarinet, short staples on oboe reeds) and finally realized what was causing the problem quite a while later. My body temperature is about 1°C lower than what is regarded as normal. (I have a fever at 37°.) This effects the temperature of the air inside the instrument I’m playing, slowing the velocity of sound that propagates through it. The audible upshot is that I’m playing too flat and it has nothing to do with technique. I’ve corroborated this with other people who are similarly “cool.”

So a question that might seem utterly irrelevant — but is your own body temperature normally on the low side?

Actually I'm usually around 99 degrees Fahrenheit, so I'm a tad bit warmer than the average person. Interesting observation, though!

[Conical bore]

It's a fascinating idea that some of us would blow a flute flat due to body temperature, but if that was true, then wouldn't it be a point of interest for those playing metal Boehm flutes? I did a quick Google search and didn't find anything about it. We only vary a degree or two for body temps, so I suspect that environmental factors are more relevant. All of this subject to correction of course, it's an interesting idea.

[Jayhawk]

I also have a chronic problem with playing too flat on any and every of the direct-blown wind instruments I’ve used. I compensated for it in the hardware when I was a kid (extra short barrel on my clarinet, short staples on oboe reeds) and finally realized what was causing the problem quite a while later. My body temperature is about 1°C lower than what is regarded as normal. (I have a fever at 37°.) This effects the temperature of the air inside the instrument I’m playing, slowing the velocity of sound that propagates through it. The audible upshot is that I’m playing too flat and it has nothing to do with technique. I’ve corroborated this with other people who are similarly “cool.”

So a question that might seem utterly irrelevant — but is your own body temperature normally on the low side?

Although I live in the farenheit world, I'm normally 1.5 degrees below normal and I tend to blow sharp on most flutes. Personally, I think it's about technique and lung power...good embouchure and strong lungs you'll tend to blow sharp. At least that's my experience.

Eric

[stringbed]

I used to work for a large-scale recorder manufacturer as one of six tuners and voicers. One of the job requirements was proficiency on the instrument. Part of gearing up was calibrating our Stroboconn tuners to individual variation in the pitch at which we played a reference instrument. Blowing pressure was tracked by placing a small flexible tube into the corner of the player’s mouth and feeding the air in parallel to a manometer. There was a set target value that nobody had any trouble adhering to. The additional significance of the temperature of that air was recognized but not measured. Every instrument was double-checked by a single one of us but there was rarely a problem with inconsistent pitch levels in the instruments delivered for inspection.

I know that this practice was followed at competing facilities. This is the second time something of core significance that we all took to be a matter of established fact has been contradicted by the experience of others. So I guess (with some surprise) that we’re in a YMMV situation.

[Cyberknight]

I used to work for a large-scale recorder manufacturer as one of six tuners and voicers. One of the job requirements was proficiency on the instrument. Part of gearing up was calibrating our Stroboconn tuners to individual variation in the pitch at which we played a reference instrument. Blowing pressure was tracked by placing a small flexible tube into the corner of the player’s mouth and feeding the air in parallel to a manometer. There was a set target value that nobody had any trouble adhering to. The additional significance of the temperature of that air was recognized but not measured. Every instrument was double-checked by a single one of us but there was rarely a problem with inconsistent pitch levels in the instruments delivered for inspection.

I know that this practice was followed at competing facilities. This is the second time something of core significance that we all took to be a matter of established fact has been contradicted by the experience of others. So I guess (with some surprise) that we’re in a YMMV situation.

This is a total tangent that has nothing to do with the topic of the thread, but I've always been curious (and I thought I'd ask you, because you're the first recorder manufacturer I've encountered): Why do recorders sound so different from whistles? Even the whistles that people say sound "recorder-like" - like Susatos - sound so extremely different from recorders that it makes me wonder what is making the difference. Is it the shape of the airway? The size of the blade? The extreme taper?

The difference seems even more pronounced the larger the instrument gets. An alto recorder has almost the exact same range as a low G whistle, but it sounds absolutely NOTHING like one. It has a much more distinct, less breathy, more "clarinet-like" sound to it than a low G whistle does, but it's also (I think) a lot quieter. Why is this?

[stringbed]

Why do recorders sound so different from whistles? Even the whistles that people say sound “recorder-like” - like Susatos - sound so extremely different from recorders that it makes me wonder what is making the difference. Is it the shape of the airway? The size of the blade? The extreme taper?

The difference seems even more pronounced the larger the instrument gets. An alto recorder has almost the exact same range as a low G whistle, but it sounds absolutely NOTHING like one. It has a much more distinct, less breathy, more “clarinet-like” sound to it than a low G whistle does, but it’s also (I think) a lot quieter. Why is this?

There’s plenty of tonal variation within each of these groups. I’m not sure I agree that what a recorder maker would regard as a narrow-bored cylindrical instrument would be heard as fundamentally different from a cylindrical wooden instrument produced by a whistle maker. It’s easier to speak categorically about differing characteristics if the comparison is between metal whistles and wooden recorders. A large part of that lies in the difference between the thickness of their walls. The greater it becomes, the more the internal geometry of the toneholes becomes a manipulable and audible factor. It also maps into how the instrument can be voiced. As demonstrated by the Susato, this is the overriding factor.

The difference between the sounds of recorders and whistles is minuscule compared to the variation among organ pipe stops made on the same basic principle. They are referred to as flue or labial pipes, and are grouped in three tonal families. The first consists of the principals (aka diapasons) that largely determine the characteristic pipe organ sound. The other two are flutes and strings, abounding with stops intended to emulate orchestral and other instruments. Blockflöte (German for recorder) and Flageolet are commonplace and I wouldn’t be surprised if there was a Tin Whistle or two out there. Although made on the exact same principle, there are string stops that only an erudite ear would recognize as flue pipes.

One of the differentiating factors is the gross geometry of the pipe. Two of the primary forms are open cylindrical and conical tubes. These also figure in the answer to your question about the diff between recorder and whistle sounds, as well as differences within the respective groups. Organ pipe makers additionally characterize stops by the ratio between the circumference of a pipe and the width of its mouth (what we’d call the window). The ratio between the width and height of the mouth is another main scaling factor. From there on everything is a matter of how the pipe is voiced, which is equally germane to the distinctive sounds of tin whistles and recorders. (There’s a good intro to how flue pipes are voiced here.)