Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

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Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by tradlad123 »

Looking for players of her flute for tips on getting a good bell note. I’m able to get a decent one on a couple other flutes but this one is a tough nut for me.
Thanks in advance!
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an seanduine
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by an seanduine »

Check this out:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GwkW8J ... tj&index=1
This is Leslie Ann Harrison, who plays a Lesouef flute.

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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Loren »

an seanduine wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 1:46 am Check this out:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GwkW8J ... tj&index=1
This is Leslie Ann Harrison, who plays a Lesouef flute.

Bob
Some useful tips for the OP there Bob, I’d just caution against actually making the “O” and “H” sounds that she uses to demonstrate - breathing with an open throat is important avoid the sort of sub-vocalizing and other sounds that closed throat and narrowed vocal folds can produce, which can become difficult sounds to get rid of once a habit of breathing that way has been established.

On another note: I’ve always found practicing long tones on the low D note to be the quickest and surest way to get a grip on what a particular flute needs on the bottom, even the odd flute that seems weaker there than others I’ve run across. 15 minutes of solid looooong tone practice just on that bottom note will usually work wonders, assuming you can manage to avoid passing out :twisted: Good time to also practice your actual full breath in technique, as well as embouchure efficiency.

Take a deep breath, focus and direct your embouchure, start and maintain a well (diaphragm) supported airstream and hang on that bottom note while making tiny adjustments to embouchure direction and focus. Don’t try to jump around with wild changes, just try to gradually home in on something that improves your tone and volume, then stay there until you need to take another breath and repeat. Focus more on connecting with the sound/tone/volume that you want as you play each long tone, rather than the technical aspects, not that these should be ignored, but too much focus on thinking about where to move your jaw, what to do with your lips, etc, can easily cause one to get too much into one’s head, when the sound is where you should be living - we tend to gravitate towards good tone production if we can focus well enough and long enough on the tone as we produce it.

Let us know how it goes and what ends up working for you.
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by tstermitz »

My first flute was a Lesouef, and I felt it was easy to get good tone and strong lower notes out of it, even for a rank beginner. My other flutes have not been so easy, especially my antique flutes.

I found Leslie Ann Harrison's video lesson very helpful; better than advice from random flute players (like me) on the internet. Practicing her ideas has even strengthened my low C note, which is harder to play on my flute. It shows that a professional teacher has some tricks up her sleeve for communicating ideas. One caveat might be that the success of applying her specific advice for a low-D depends on whether you already have some strength or control in your embouchure. It benefited me at this specific time in my training - five years into flute. I'm not sure that a younger me would have been as successful.

Loren suggests long-tones. That is universally recommended, and I find that is helpful. Again that has more observable benefits now that I have more experience and more muscle control.

I believe she is merely using the "heh" and "hoh" sounds to give you a guide to notice if your throat/mouth is open of closed. She is saying that the "heh" indicates a problem, while "hoh" sound is a sign of a more open throat.

I have found that my low notes benefit immensely from playing high notes. Achieving high notes means that my embouchure is stronger, which enables the low notes. In any case, after playing in the third register for a short while, I always find a huge improvement when I return to low notes.
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Loren »

tstermitz wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 10:05 am

I believe she is merely using the "heh" and "hoh" sounds to give you a guide to notice if your throat/mouth is open of closed. She is saying that the "heh" indicates a problem, while "hoh" sound is a sign of a more open throat.
I have no doubt you are correct and my only intention was to point out that actually making the sounds she used for demonstration purposes would not be part of the actual practice. Most folks would likely have understood that, but where there’s room for misinterpretation, well….. :wink:
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by jim stone »

I third Loren on the value of long tones.
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by an seanduine »

Leslie, in the first volume of her tutor, also has some exercises that seem to directly address getting a stronger ´bark´ on the low D.

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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by cac »

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but Leslie Ann Harrison used to play an Olwell Pratten model to which keys had been added by Maurice Reviol. The odd semi-circular shaped G# key is what indicated that to me, and it is present on this video. Does Solen Lesoeuf make the same shape G# key?
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Loren »

cac wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:28 pm Please correct me if I'm wrong, but Leslie Ann Harrison used to play an Olwell Pratten model to which keys had been added by Maurice Reviol. The odd semi-circular shaped G# key is what indicated that to me, and it is present on this video. Does Solen Lesoeuf make the same shape G# key?
Interesting you should mention this Chet. When I watched the video the first thing I noticed was the Olwell looking finial on the endcap and the dullish colored post mounted keys with the curved G# like Maurice tends to use. The flute doesn’t look like any of Solen’s flutes that I’ve seen pictures of. Looked a bit Frankenflute and so I was wondering…….
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Flutern »

cac wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 4:28 pm Please correct me if I'm wrong, but Leslie Ann Harrison used to play an Olwell Pratten model to which keys had been added by Maurice Reviol. The odd semi-circular shaped G# key is what indicated that to me, and it is present on this video. Does Solen Lesoeuf make the same shape G# key?
It definitely looks like Maurice's keywork in the video.
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by an seanduine »

OK, guys, unless my mind has completely slipped, somewhere on her website or Youtube tutorials, Leslie states she is playing a flute by Solen. It is also my understanding, also subject to the rickety functioning of my aging brain, that Solen is not currently making her own keywork. Appearances, as they say, can be deceiving. The finial on the flute appears to me to be fairly generic, no more similar to many 19th Century English flutes than Olwell´s.

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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by an seanduine »

Here is a picture of Leslie with her two flutes:https://www.leslieanneharrison.com/
The one is, I believe stated to be a Miramatsu. . . .a not shabby Boehm. The other, although no finial is viewable from this angle, again, I believe to be stated as a Lesouef.
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Flutern »

an seanduine wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 10:03 pm OK, guys, unless my mind has completely slipped, somewhere on her website or Youtube tutorials, Leslie states she is playing a flute by Solen. It is also my understanding, also subject to the rickety functioning of my aging brain, that Solen is not currently making her own keywork. Appearances, as they say, can be deceiving.
Have a look at this keyed Reviol. You'll see that the keywork is identical, and very different from the block-mounted keywork that Solen Lesouef does, at least judging from the photos on her website.
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Loren »

an seanduine wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 10:31 pm Here is a picture of Leslie with her two flutes:https://www.leslieanneharrison.com/
The one is, I believe stated to be a Miramatsu. . . .a not shabby Boehm. The other, although no finial is viewable from this angle, again, I believe to be stated as a Lesouef.
Bob, while the flute in question is not well lit in the photo you linked to, there are a few things of note we can see immediately:

1. Possibly most telling is the 1 line, straight lettering stamp on the RH section of the flute: This is the approximate size, shape and location of an Olwell flute’s RH body maker’s stamp, although I can’t make out what the stamp says on my phone, perhaps others with a larger screen can.

Certainly some other makers do stamp the RH section of their flutes, most of them look different - curved, full circle, colored, different size or location, etc. - however none of the photos on Solen’s site (at least none that I am seeing) show ANY stamps on the RH sections of her flutes.

2. The barrel shape: Solen’s flutes tend to have a very obvious curve/recurve bulge on the socket end of the barrel, while the flute in question appears to have the flat, slightly tapering flare line to the socket, like an Olwell, and a number of other maker’s flutes. Doesn’t look like Solen’s flutes on the website though.

3. The rings: Again, judging by the website photos, when Solen is using just “standard” rings on a flute, she tends to use essentially the same/similar size silver wire for all the bands, while Olwell uses markedly slimmer wire ONLY at on one side of the bottom end of Headjoint and the top end of the barrel - where the the two sections meet, or should if you closed the slide completely (“This is an Eb session you say…”). Again, this use of differing wire size is not unique to Olwell flutes, but it is inconsistent with what Solen seems to do regularly.


As for the finial, yes, other makers have (R.I.P Michael Grinter) and perhaps occasionally still do (I’m looking at you Mr. Wilkes), make their end caps with finials, so I’m just combining my other observations with the finial and playing the odds. I could possibly identify the maker by the end cap alone, with a clear and close enough shot because they have their differences, but that would just be showing off wouldn’t it :P

At one point I thought this was possibly a case of an Olwell HJ on someone else’s flute, but the stamp in the photo along with the other details makes :) it look more and more like a complete Olwell with Reviol’s keys added. Makes me wonder if this is actually the flute Niall Keegan is alleged to have tried at one point and pronounced “The Perfect Flute” due to it being an Olwell with post mounted keywork. I believe Leslie went to UL and would certainly have interacted with Mr. Chromatic, no?

I’ve made some other observations about the flute but this post is getting way too long and I still haven’t had my second cup of coffee so….

Fun little mystery about this flute that will no doubt be solved with clarification from someone in the know before long. Of course at the end of the day we all know the flute is just a (wonderful) tool to get the music out, the playing is the thing :)
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Re: Tips for a solid low D on Lesouëf flute.

Post by Loren »

I need to correct myself on one detail, because details matter, well in this case perhaps only to me, and the Olwells. The Olwell stamps on the flutes I own are very slightly curved, not completely straight line. I seem to recall older (20+ yrs?) Olwell stamps being completely straight, but prior to actually working in a woodwind shop and having to deal with .001” tolerances every day, I was, in fact, somewhat less exacting in my observation of details…..
Also, prior to that work I had no experience trying to stamp straight line text and/or numbers on a round and tapering object. :boggle: It can be done, but I won’t bore with the details.

So, again, with regards to my statement previously that the Olwell stamp is completely straight line, this is not accurate. Certainly on the examples I currently the Olwell name stamp is ever so slightly curved.

Now for the purposes of our discussion in the case of Leslie’s flute, my comments stand regarding the look and location of the stamp certainly could match that of an Olwell.

BTW, did anyone else notice the location of the foot joint vent holes? They appear to be facing back towards the player, or possibly down more towards the floor. This, to me is another likely indication of the keywork having been added to a previously keyless flute. Not proof of course, but another bit.
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