Chiff and Fipple Forums

I am hoping to pick up the Irish flute and plan to start with the usual approach, i.e. a keyless flute in D. So far, so good. As it happens I am a former fiddle player — ”former” because I broke my elbow, which is why I am looking for a new instrument.

I am coming from Swedish music, so I don’t know ITM at all but am willing to explore it. However I am pretty sure that I will eventually want to play my previous (Swedish) repertoire now and then, which brings me to the problem of key signatures and associated flute hardware. I was an ear player and have never understood music theory, but I do know that my favorite Swedish fiddle tunes tend to be in G minor.

I am wondering if getting a 6-key or 8-key flute in D would enable me to play comfortably in G minor down the road, or if the usual practice is to bring along a whistle in a different key for that?

G minor might mean two flats, or it might mean one flat, i.e. G-dorian. The Dorian modes are quite common in ITM, but I don't know that much about Swedish music. If I recall, Swedish music also uses lots of accidentals.

Yes, you will need 6 or 8 keys to play outside of the key of G (one sharp) or D (two sharps). 8 keys if you want to play the low C note, which comes up relatively frequently in G-minor/G-dorian tunes. You can fold the note, but I think you should look at scores for the Swedish music you like in order see how what the keys are.

The one or two times I tried playing Swedish music, I noticed how interesting the harmonies are. Playing a duet with a fiddle player, and the chords were really unusual.

Gm is quite accessible on a fully keyed simple system flute, allowing for a bit of work.... :

When the Tide Comes In or Factory Smoke - Geo. Rudall (Willis fecit) 8-key flute
https://www.facebook.com/story.php?stor ... =605989270

The Drunken Sailor Hornpipe - R&R #3981
https://youtu.be/Ud9oVwzahRA&t=2m29s

The Presbyterian Hornpipe - R&R #3981 https://youtu.be/apRNJnWIr8U&t=6m25s

King Of The Fairies (in Gm) - R&R #2130:
https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/NftLd

The Galway Bay Hornpipe x2 - Gautié ring key Böhm flute & then R&R #4683 8-key flute
https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/7dUZM

Captain O'Kane or The Wounded Hussar (attrib O'Carolan) - on R&R #4683 with Wilkes head
https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/D5Dm3

It depends on what you mean by G minor. If you mean G Dorian... The flutes that I have can mostly cross-finger Bb pretty well, but F natural is not so good. It can be done on a Baroque flute, but that is probably not what you want for ITM.

I can also cross-finger G#, but it is a bit veiled in the low octave. But for Eb you really need a key.

Obviously it depends on your instrument how well cross-fingerings work. For ITM I find that just having an F natural key covers almost everything that I need. Eb doesn't turn up very much. In fact you can cover the majority of the tunes with no keys. Some people play flutes with no keys, and bring along a couple of whistles for those occasional tunes that need those special notes.

I don't know a lot about Swedish music, but I think it is a bit more chromatic. Like, you might need an F natural and a G# in the same tune.

Get 6 or 8 keys and you will be ready for anything, though.

Since you have a background i swedish music, do you live in sweden? If so, I have a 8-key flute that I don't use that you can try out and buy if it suits you. It's in Cocus-wood with german silver keys. Gm will not be a problem, and it is my favorite key as well, being a swedish fiddle player.

Hej Pipa - Here's a fingering chart for a keyless flute in D that Martin Doyle has put up:

Fingering Chart 2 – Accidental Notes for Traditional Flute
http://www.martindoyleflutes.com/fingering-charts.html

So if you already have, or intend to buy, a keyless flute then you could use this chart while you are waiting for a keyed flute to turn up.

Do you already play the flute, or are you intending to learn the flute? If you order a new keyed flute it could take a while as some flute makers have very long waiting lists. You could also buy a second hand keyed flute.

Var bor du nånstans?

Thank you everyone for all of the suggestions. I’ve bought a keyless Folk Flute, so I will start on that and see if I can manage it. (I was already staving off cubital tunnel syndrome before the elbow crack, so the flute is very much an experiment and might not work out.)

Pekkos and Steampacket, I’m Swedish-American and live in the US. I played fiddle for about 15 years and used to go to Sweden for summer courses (Malungs folkhögskola, Föllingeveckan m m). I have to find a new instrument and Irish music is very popular where I live, so I am going to see if the flute will be a good solution. But I still want to play Swedish music too!

Jag har precis blivit insläppt till traversflöjtspelare på fejan, vi ses kanske där?

So, you now have a keyless, which has two different minor modes, Em and Am. As some of the others, I don't know anything about Swedish folk music, but it seems reasonable that one of those two would be reaonably close, even if you can't play along with recordings. I taught myself "Toss The Feathers" from memory in the wrong key (I figured it out in Em, but the recording I had listened to so many times years ago that I memorized it was in Dm). So, if it's in your head, you can figure it out.

Another thing to consider, if the D flute's Am works well enough, you could grab a C whistle and play along with Gm recordings. Not exactly the same as playing along with a flute, but a lot....cheaper! And all of the fingerings from C whistle carry over to the flute, so once you've worked it out, you can then play it on the flute.