Intonation again

[Terry McGee]

I notice Jumbuck hasn't returned to the topic since posting the original question. Does that mean you've worked out the problem, Jumbuck, or has the discussion wandered too far away to help you any further?

I'd echo what has been said earlier:
- tune to A, if that seems reasonably representative of most of the notes, or G if not. A is preferable if possible as that's what will be going round at the start of the session. Certainly don't tune to low D if it's flatter than the other notes. Work on bringing it up, not the others down.
- really give the method at http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/Getting_the ... k_tone.htm a solid go. If, as your post suggests, your low D note tends flat, this will pour more of the energy into the harmonics of low D and reduce the contribution the low D makes. This will sharpen the pitch of the apparent hard D. Blowing down further into the flute also makes it harder for the flute to snap to middle D.
- do experiment with stopper position. It won't have any effect on the pitch of the low octave, but it may have an effect on how easy and effective the blowing down method produces a hard D.
- you haven't said how far out the notes are. Don't obsess over a few cents. The real test is if you can play along with other good players and not be noticeably out of tune.
- if none of that is working, don't suffer in silence!

Although the nominal position of the stopper in conical flutes is taken these days as 19mm (3/4"), I suspect that is founded on a myth. Those few old flutes we have found that have marks have suggested 17mm was regarded as the norm in the 19th century. An example is shown near the bottom of:

http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/Sicc_Ext.htm

That position doesn't assist sweet playing of low D, but it probably does help with playing Hard D. In other words, you might find the best stopper position is dependant on the way you play.

You can see the effect of stopper position at:

http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/Stopper.html

Terry

[Jumbuk]

Thanks Terry and others. I have been solidly at work meetings all week with no time for forum chatting, so please excuse lack of feedback.

Just to lay a few issues to rest:

- "tin ear": no way readers could have known this, but I have been playing instruments for around 30 years, and (with modesty) I am known within my own family for my ear.

- Tuning measures: I was using my string tuner (electronic) to give you the approximate variations in tuning, but you don't need a tuner to hear them - they are quite obvious to my daughter (fiddler).

- Cork placement: I have Casey's guidelines, and I did check it out.

I am off to read and try Terry's ideas. I'll post again when (if) I have made noticeable progress.

PS I have played in sessions where no one has said anything about my intonation, but that means little. Most session players are too polite to criticise another's playing unless you are being loud or obnoxious!

[JohnB]

Hi Jumbuk

I had a similiar problem and didn't realise until I started to record myself - what a shock it sounded dreadful (but not so bad when playing with someone).

Anyway a few of things that seemed to work for me.

1. I tightened up my embouchure after being told that this was a problem at a workshop run by Siobhan O'Donnell she said I needed to stretch it.
2. As others have suggested playing slow notes and scales against a note on the PC (and with the tuner) this helped in getting out of the habit of playing out of tune.
3. Trying to lip the note more than rolling the flute - there is a James Galway you tube clip that shows this quite well.
4. Playing along with slowed recordings of flute players.

I've been doing this more than any other flute activety just concentrating on playing in tune and it's paying off - I'm now playing stuff that sounds alot better.

Good luck

John