Curious Boxwood Flute on Ebay

Sillydill · Post by **Sillydill** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:02 am

This is a "curious" Boxwood flute currently on Ebay, made by "E. G. WILLIAMS LONDON".

Here's a link:http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 7389441417

Here's their picture.

Most unusuall keywork and it plays in C#, definately "Curious"!

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:17 am

Jordan,

LH high pitch flute, maybe?

Eric

chas · Post by **chas** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 12:46 pm

How odd, the Bflat and Cnat keys are both played by the left-hand fingers. I'm always suspicious of high-pitch flutes -- None of those I've played are in tune with themselves.

Unseen122 · Post by **Unseen122** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:14 pm

it can't be left handed look at the short F. Looks like it would be good for Boylan/Doorley Grip, if I hadn't just bought the Burns I might have to try for it.

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 5:39 pm

You're right about the short F. Perhaps made for a circus side show performer?

RudallRose · Post by **RudallRose** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 7:40 pm

it actually does appear to be a flute for the left hand.
The short-F touch shouldn't hamper when the key cup is opposite the hand (assuming you hold this flute right-handed). Our short-Fs normally are touch/key on the palm side with the long-F taking up the other side.
The Tromlitz key made it popular to have the single F-hole with a double touch (one for RH and other for LH).
No, the key to seeing this flute is indeed the upper (heart) piece, which holds the first 3 finger holes.
Why left hand? Not because of the interesting C or Bb key placements.
It would be the G# key.
As the touch is situated here, it would be very impractical to hold it in the left hand and have to REACH OVER the flute with your pinkey to activate the G# key. The hand naturally slopes away, AND the pinkey is shortest finger.
But...
hold it in your right hand.....
fingers angled....and suddenly the G# is easily accessible (although somewhat impractically placed) and the other two keys are easily activated merely by lowering your fingers onto the touches, since they will sit just below them.
Again, impractical....
unless the player held the instrument as would a piper, with fingers perpendicular to the flute body.
HMMMM

I suppose the only precise way to know is look at the embouchure. As most of the day were cut for right-handed playing, this one should be cut on BOTH sides at the worst, and on the left-handed-playing side at best.

RudallRose · Post by **RudallRose** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 7:44 pm

then again....
on close inspection of the photos....you can see the wear marks from the hand coming from a left hand for the upper piece....
and the embouchure worn on the side of a right-handed player...

too....the left-hand keys are in fact angled to accommodate the left hand.

Still...
very interesting flute

shows they were all trying something back then to distinguish themselves.
most....happily....failed.

glinjack · Post by **glinjack** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 7:55 pm

E G Williams was active in London about 1803--1810, I believe he was a music publisher and dealer in woodwinds, most of the flutes thast bear his name were made by other makers, possibly the Wood family and were all block mounted and not pin mounted like the flute on ebay,
As a matter of fact i dont know of any London maker using pin mounts at that period or for many years later,
Obviously the ebay flute is a partial copy of a Williams and with pin mounts
which williams flutes never had.

RudallRose · Post by **RudallRose** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:04 pm

you're probably right, John

The pin mount system was first patented and derived by frenchman Claude Laurent, who devised it as a way to mount keys on his crystal flutes. Obviously block mounts were not possible.
He was quite prolific at the time of Napoleon (he ought to be as the emperor had 3 of them!).

Jack Bradshaw · Post by **Jack Bradshaw** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:37 pm

glinjack wrote:E G Williams was active in London about 1803--1810, I believe he was a music publisher and dealer in woodwinds, most of the flutes thast bear his name were made by other makers, possibly the Wood family and were all block mounted and not pin mounted like the flute on ebay,
As a matter of fact i dont know of any London maker using pin mounts at that period or for many years later,
Obviously the ebay flute is a partial copy of a Williams and with pin mounts
which williams flutes never had.

Or a Williams that was fitted with keys much later....ie the foot joint comments

glinjack · Post by **glinjack** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:38 pm

Or a Williams that was fitted with keys much later....ie the foot joint comments

Yes Jack that could be very well true, The foot joint key is not an original
Williams key, but it does match the other keys on the flute,
The flute probably started out as a one keyed flute and quite possibly a Williams flute especially if you look at the bulbous area around the embouchure, that type of head joint shape is typical of 18th c and early 19th c one keyed and four keyed flutes,
It is possible that a previous owner wanted extra keys or wanted to experiment with the placement of extra keys to suit their ideas, so the original (possibly square key) was removed and replaced with a foot joint key to match the added keys.