buying eyeglass frames online

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Brian Lee
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Post by Brian Lee »

gonzo914 wrote:
Brian Lee wrote:Eyeglasses are a MEDICAL DEVICE, and really must be fit by a trained professional to optimize both visual quality and frame comfort.
That's why, when you go to the optometrist, your eyeglasses are fit by his golf buddy's highly-trained 17-year-old daughter who needs a part-time job after school.
I would find a new office then - simple as that. When you bring in an outside frame there are several reasons the dispensary may charge you more: First, there is no way for the dispensary to know with certainty that the frame is new, is capable of holding new lenses (as often the glazing process will stress a frame and can cause it to fail), or is adjustable for the needs of the individual patient.

When you buy your glasses as a complete unit from your optician, you should be presented with a complete package. The frames and lenses should NEVER be thought of as being two completely separate entities. It comes together as a single unit, and should be optimized for your own visual needs and facial structures. Generally as well, unless you're going to one of the mega-discount chains or big box retail outlets, you should also get a decent warranty against manufacturer defects. Ask.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.
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Post by gonzo914 »

Brian Lee wrote:
gonzo914 wrote:
Brian Lee wrote:Eyeglasses are a MEDICAL DEVICE, and really must be fit by a trained professional to optimize both visual quality and frame comfort.
That's why, when you go to the optometrist, your eyeglasses are fit by his golf buddy's highly-trained 17-year-old daughter who needs a part-time job after school.
I would find a new office then - simple as that.
I did. They are still not opticians, but they are at least grown-ups, and my glasses do fit better.

I see a couple of problems with the system as it is. First, there do not seem to be any certification or training requirements for the people who fit your glasses at the optometrist. They can pull anyone off the street to do this. If I go to an optician for my glasses, am I assured of getting someone trained?

Second, whenever you ask the optometrist to write the prescription so you can take it to an optician, they get all pissy and imply that if you don't get your glasses from them, you're probably going to get some sub-standard, imported knock-off made in a third-world country that can't even make toys that won't poison your kids, let alone something as important as glasses.
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Post by Ronbo »

That's why you get your eyes examined by the optometrist, who is trained for that as well as being able to prescribe medicine if needed. Then take the prescription (no matter how pissy they get about it. ) and take it to a good optician. They know the mechanical side of glasses better than most anyone. STAY AWAY from the one-stop shop, ala Lenscrafters. They are in it for a buck, and that is it.

I had to get an eye exam several years past, and had to do it in a very short time. Stopped at the local lenscrafters, who had a licensed optometrist onboard. I told the obligatory 17 year old sales girl out front exactly what I wanted to do. Get the prescription, take it with me and have it filled where I was working at the time. Her reply was to the point that "they can't fill OUR prescriptions properly." I asked, why not? Are they in chinese? "Well, our eye exam is much more detailed than they can understand. so they have to be filled in-house." I called the manager over, explained the LAW and how it's supposed to work, and recommended that she fire the salesperson, then go to a mirror and fire herself. Now I tell everybody who asks ( or does not), to stay away from lenscrafters, and any other glasses mill like that. I will always go to the best optometrist I can afford for the exams and to the best optical shop I can find to get the hardware done. It's the only way you can avoid getting screwed both ways.
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Post by Jack »

Ronbo wrote:That's why you get your eyes examined by the optometrist, who is trained for that as well as being able to prescribe medicine if needed. Then take the prescription (no matter how pissy they get about it. ) and take it to a good optician. They know the mechanical side of glasses better than most anyone. STAY AWAY from the one-stop shop, ala Lenscrafters. They are in it for a buck, and that is it.
What about Eyeglass World? That's where I'm headed tomorrow, it seems. I have a friend who went there and had good luck.

I should add that I *do* have a copy of my Prescription, signed by my doctor. When I called Eyeglass World they told me that that's all I needed to buy new frames and they'd have my glasses made in about an hour.
Last edited by Jack on Mon Mar 10, 2008 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by jkwest »

I bought my glasses online.

lenses and frames.

got them at www.optical4less.com

got two pair with my exact prescription and shipped from Japan for $100.

I use them every day when I'm in front of the computer screen...can't complain. Antiglare lenses too!

good luck Cran.
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Post by Ronbo »

Cranberry wrote:
Ronbo wrote:That's why you get your eyes examined by the optometrist, who is trained for that as well as being able to prescribe medicine if needed. Then take the prescription (no matter how pissy they get about it. ) and take it to a good optician. They know the mechanical side of glasses better than most anyone. STAY AWAY from the one-stop shop, ala Lenscrafters. They are in it for a buck, and that is it.
What about Eyeglass World? That's where I'm headed tomorrow, it seems. I have a friend who went there and had good luck.

I should add that I *do* have a copy of my Prescription, signed by my doctor. When I called Eyeglass World they told me that that's all I needed to buy new frames and they'd have my glasses made in about an hour.
You are almost forced to get better service than the place I went. When you go online, your opportunities to get corrections go way down the tubes, and when you go to the stop and shops, you can get service that varies from horrid to excellent. I just would not want to trust my eyes to somebody I could not look directly in the eye, and assure myself that he or she knew what they were doing. If your friend had a good experience, fine, but it doesn't guarantee that yours will be. Depends a lot on your own eye condition, and the talent and knowledge of the optometrist who first looks at you. Some of the one stops have optometrists, and others have full-fledged ophthamologists, who are medical doctors. I would go to one who has one of them there things if I could.
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Post by missy »

Ronbo - the Lenscrafter up the street from me has a very, very good optamologist. While I just need periodic "checks" to see if everything is ok (as I said at the beginning of this thread, I had Lasik 9 years ago), he still does a thorough job and doesn't cost a fortune - and I'm not getting any glasses or contacts made.
He goes to Africa several times a year and does eye care and surgery with a mission group.

I've been going to optamologists since I was 3 years old (had problems with cysts and things around my eye and eventually had to have surgery), so I never have my eyes checked by anything less.
But I REALLY hate having my eyes dilated. They never go "back" until I go to sleep that night, and I seem to always pick the sunniest, brightest day to go! I also hate the newer glaucoma tests (with the puff of air). Give me the old needle gauge anyday.
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Post by Ronbo »

Unfortunately, I am nowhere near you, Missy. Otherwise, I might give that one a shot. When I got talked down to by a 17-year old sister of somebody, I decided that was not the place I wanted to trust with any of my body parts, specially the eyes. Funny thing, when you get to be my age, good-lookin women don't get any less good-lookin, they just seem to move faster. :)
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Post by Brian Lee »

missy wrote:Ronbo - the Lenscrafter up the street from me has a very, very good optamologist. While I just need periodic "checks" to see if everything is ok (as I said at the beginning of this thread, I had Lasik 9 years ago), he still does a thorough job and doesn't cost a fortune - and I'm not getting any glasses or contacts made.
He goes to Africa several times a year and does eye care and surgery with a mission group.

I've been going to optamologists since I was 3 years old (had problems with cysts and things around my eye and eventually had to have surgery), so I never have my eyes checked by anything less.
But I REALLY hate having my eyes dilated. They never go "back" until I go to sleep that night, and I seem to always pick the sunniest, brightest day to go! I also hate the newer glaucoma tests (with the puff of air). Give me the old needle gauge anyday.
Sounds like some minor clarification is needed here:

Ophthalmologist - a medical doctor who specializes in eyes and is the only physician you should see if you need INVASIVE surgery of the globe, orbits or adnexa (lids and surrounding tissue) also performs LASIK, LASEK , PRK, RK etc. They are eye SURGEONS, which does not make them ANY better at refracting or fitting eyeglasses. Some in fact refuse to refract or fit at all, preferring instead to focus exclusively on surgery, and medical issues.

Optometrist - also a doctor with a MINIMUM of eight years of school, four university, and four specifically in optometry. Far more directly related eye training initially than an MD/ophthalmologist. In many cases, you will see a much higher percentage of actual face time with the doctor seeing an optometrist, and will, as a general rule, have a much greater chance of accurate refraction and overall assessment of general ocular health with an optometrist. Bear in mind however, that this may not ALWAYS be the case.

Optician - a support technician (as a nurse is to an MD) who administers tests, may or may not fit spectacle lenses and/or contacts, and a huge variety of other duties around the practice. Opticians may or may not choose to sit for national board exams to certify their level of expertise. And there are more than one level, as well as several other optional certifications available depending on the individuals career choice. Several states (Arizona and Nevada come immediately to mind) also require STATE certification which is generally several orders of magnitude more difficult than the national boards and often requires a certain number of years actively working in the field in that state before the exams can even be taken. Many opticians are capable and indeed DO much of the pre-testing and even refractions for their optometrist or ophthalmologist.

Not every state requires certification however, and not every doctors office requires even the national ABOC standard be met. Hiring experience is expensive in ANY field, and medicine is no different. A sad truth is also that regardless of certifications on the wall, a bad optician is still a bad optician. There are plenty of doctors who are simply in it to make a quick buck - and this is of course not limited in any way to the optical field.

So what can you possibly do? The answer is simple. ASK. Ask to see the certification of your optician. Ask them about their experience. What fields have they worked in? How many years? Take in an old pair of glasses and have them adjust them. Are you COMPLETELY happy? Do you have ANY question or doubt as to their ability? Do you feel rushed out the door or like you're an annoyance to the office as soon as you step inside?

Or - do you feel like the professional sitting across from you really cares about your vision? Do they ask you questions about your lifestyle in order to really TRULY get to know you? Do they make you feel comfortable and encourage you to ask questions of them yourself? Do they take ALL THE TIME NEEDED to make absolutely CERTAIN all of your questions are answered? Do they offer EVERY possible option for you regardless of cost, and explain how they each relate to your prescription? Do YOU feel like you're the most important person in the practice when you enter, and even more so once you've paid and left?

There are SO MANY misleading advertisements in the medical world these days, and possibly most of all in the optical industry. Thin and light lenses. Glasses in an hour. Try anything and if you don't like it bring it back whenever, no questions asked. There are ALWAYS exceptions and reasons companies advertise certain things like these and they are not always in your best interest.

The point is that the doctor/patient or optician/patient relationship is a two way street. You don't have to be mean, or demanding. But you DO have to go in with a sense of what you would like to accomplish with your vision. Sometimes, and very likely MOST of the time, it won't be the fastest or the cheapest option. But it will be the CORRECT option to optimize your vision needs and afford you the very best vision you've ever had in your life.

I'll apologize in advance if this post oversteps the medical advice guidelines and won't be offended if it needs to be deleted. My hope is simply that people will realize that ANY fitting of a medical device requires participation from both the physician/technician and the patient. This is true with any situation involving someone with knowledge or expertise and someone hoping to benefit from it I believe.

If you come to Durango anytime soon, I would be most happy to give you the best experience you've ever had buying glasses. Period.

Brian~

P.S. Missy, they've NEVER (to my knowledge) EVER used a needle of any kind to test for IOP (Intra Ocular Pressure). Which, by the way, is not an indication of glaucoma by itself. It is one facet of many the doctor looks at as a whole to determine if a patient is at risk, the actual state of the optic nerve and disc being the primary indicators. The procedure you describe is called: Goldmann applanation tonometry and uses a small curved plastic probe which is VERY gently and extremely quickly applied to the front of the cornea of the numbed eye.
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Post by missy »

thanks for the clarification, Brian - it may have been plastic (it WAS a long time ago!!) but if felt like a needle!
And I still liked it better than the "puff".
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Post by Jack »

Brian Lee wrote:
missy wrote:Ronbo - the Lenscrafter up the street from me has a very, very good optamologist. While I just need periodic "checks" to see if everything is ok (as I said at the beginning of this thread, I had Lasik 9 years ago), he still does a thorough job and doesn't cost a fortune - and I'm not getting any glasses or contacts made.
He goes to Africa several times a year and does eye care and surgery with a mission group.

I've been going to optamologists since I was 3 years old (had problems with cysts and things around my eye and eventually had to have surgery), so I never have my eyes checked by anything less.
But I REALLY hate having my eyes dilated. They never go "back" until I go to sleep that night, and I seem to always pick the sunniest, brightest day to go! I also hate the newer glaucoma tests (with the puff of air). Give me the old needle gauge anyday.
Sounds like some minor clarification is needed here:

Ophthalmologist - a medical doctor who specializes in eyes and is the only physician you should see if you need INVASIVE surgery of the globe, orbits or adnexa (lids and surrounding tissue) also performs LASIK, LASEK , PRK, RK etc. They are eye SURGEONS, which does not make them ANY better at refracting or fitting eyeglasses. Some in fact refuse to refract or fit at all, preferring instead to focus exclusively on surgery, and medical issues.

Optometrist - also a doctor with a MINIMUM of eight years of school, four university, and four specifically in optometry. Far more directly related eye training initially than an MD/ophthalmologist. In many cases, you will see a much higher percentage of actual face time with the doctor seeing an optometrist, and will, as a general rule, have a much greater chance of accurate refraction and overall assessment of general ocular health with an optometrist. Bear in mind however, that this may not ALWAYS be the case.

Optician - a support technician (as a nurse is to an MD) who administers tests, may or may not fit spectacle lenses and/or contacts, and a huge variety of other duties around the practice. Opticians may or may not choose to sit for national board exams to certify their level of expertise. And there are more than one level, as well as several other optional certifications available depending on the individuals career choice. Several states (Arizona and Nevada come immediately to mind) also require STATE certification which is generally several orders of magnitude more difficult than the national boards and often requires a certain number of years actively working in the field in that state before the exams can even be taken. Many opticians are capable and indeed DO much of the pre-testing and even refractions for their optometrist or ophthalmologist.

Not every state requires certification however, and not every doctors office requires even the national ABOC standard be met. Hiring experience is expensive in ANY field, and medicine is no different. A sad truth is also that regardless of certifications on the wall, a bad optician is still a bad optician. There are plenty of doctors who are simply in it to make a quick buck - and this is of course not limited in any way to the optical field.

So what can you possibly do? The answer is simple. ASK. Ask to see the certification of your optician. Ask them about their experience. What fields have they worked in? How many years? Take in an old pair of glasses and have them adjust them. Are you COMPLETELY happy? Do you have ANY question or doubt as to their ability? Do you feel rushed out the door or like you're an annoyance to the office as soon as you step inside?

Or - do you feel like the professional sitting across from you really cares about your vision? Do they ask you questions about your lifestyle in order to really TRULY get to know you? Do they make you feel comfortable and encourage you to ask questions of them yourself? Do they take ALL THE TIME NEEDED to make absolutely CERTAIN all of your questions are answered? Do they offer EVERY possible option for you regardless of cost, and explain how they each relate to your prescription? Do YOU feel like you're the most important person in the practice when you enter, and even more so once you've paid and left?

There are SO MANY misleading advertisements in the medical world these days, and possibly most of all in the optical industry. Thin and light lenses. Glasses in an hour. Try anything and if you don't like it bring it back whenever, no questions asked. There are ALWAYS exceptions and reasons companies advertise certain things like these and they are not always in your best interest.

The point is that the doctor/patient or optician/patient relationship is a two way street. You don't have to be mean, or demanding. But you DO have to go in with a sense of what you would like to accomplish with your vision. Sometimes, and very likely MOST of the time, it won't be the fastest or the cheapest option. But it will be the CORRECT option to optimize your vision needs and afford you the very best vision you've ever had in your life.

I'll apologize in advance if this post oversteps the medical advice guidelines and won't be offended if it needs to be deleted. My hope is simply that people will realize that ANY fitting of a medical device requires participation from both the physician/technician and the patient. This is true with any situation involving someone with knowledge or expertise and someone hoping to benefit from it I believe.

If you come to Durango anytime soon, I would be most happy to give you the best experience you've ever had buying glasses. Period.

Brian~

P.S. Missy, they've NEVER (to my knowledge) EVER used a needle of any kind to test for IOP (Intra Ocular Pressure). Which, by the way, is not an indication of glaucoma by itself. It is one facet of many the doctor looks at as a whole to determine if a patient is at risk, the actual state of the optic nerve and disc being the primary indicators. The procedure you describe is called: Goldmann applanation tonometry and uses a small curved plastic probe which is VERY gently and extremely quickly applied to the front of the cornea of the numbed eye.
This is extremely helpful. Thank you a lot.
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Post by Brian Lee »

missy wrote:thanks for the clarification, Brian - it may have been plastic (it WAS a long time ago!!) but if felt like a needle!
And I still liked it better than the "puff".
Then the tech/doctor either didn't use the right numbing drop or waited far too long to check your pressures! (10 minutes and the effect is already starting to wear off)

I do hope some of this info has been helpful from the other side of the 'desk' as it were. All the best!
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Post by Flyingcursor »

Brian - How do you know so much about it? Very impressive.

I was a national board certified Optician and Ophthalmology tech many years ago. I did everything from VA testing to removing superficial corneal foreign bodies with a needle and a slit-lamp to grinding lenses for glasses. I also spent two years as an ophthalmology surgery tech.


Let me also add that if you buy frames somewhere and then take them to a different facility to have lenses, they may not have a "blank" for that particular frame. They'd have to make one which isn't as accurate.

Missy - I can't picture you with coke bottle glasses!!! -6 and -7??? :boggle: :boggle:
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Post by Jack »

Brian Lee wrote:
missy wrote:thanks for the clarification, Brian - it may have been plastic (it WAS a long time ago!!) but if felt like a needle!
And I still liked it better than the "puff".
Then the tech/doctor either didn't use the right numbing drop or waited far too long to check your pressures! (10 minutes and the effect is already starting to wear off)

I do hope some of this info has been helpful from the other side of the 'desk' as it were. All the best!
This has been extremely helpful. Thank you very much.
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Post by missy »

Flyingcursor wrote:
Missy - I can't picture you with coke bottle glasses!!! -6 and -7??? :boggle: :boggle:
that's cuz YOU met me after I had the Lasik done. Wore glasses since I was 5 years old (needed them before that), contacts from age 21 (could only wear soft ones cuz of that previous operation), and was getting to the point that I could no longer wear contacts because my capillaries were coming to the surface.

Lasik was worth every penny!!!

I did loose some close up vision (I opted for 20/20 distance so I'm over corrected for near) but at my age, who cares! I can read fine with no magnification, but I do need a bit of help with threading a needle, etc.
Missy

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