Chiff and Fipple Forums

I'm starting to (try to) do rolls. I understand it's a cut and a tap on a note and have watched some videos and practiced a bit. I'm curious about how many sounds/pitches are most desirable. And perhaps, there is not one answer but it depends on style and desired result. It seems depending on timing it could be 3,4, or 5. If the cut happens after the note starts and the cut is completed before the tap, it's 5. If the cut happens at the start of the note before the main tone sounds, that's one less. And if the cut ends exactly when the tap occurs, that's another one less.

So let's say I'm rolling F# with a cut of the G finger and a tap of the E finger. The three pitches are A, F#, and E (although when really fast, they could be more like squeaks that the pitch actually ringing). If the cut is after the note starts and the tap does not occur until after the cut is completed, I'd get F#-A-F#-E-F#. Is that the most common way to roll?

If I altered the timing of the cut to be the same instance as the tap, I could get F#-A-E-F#.

If I started the note on the cut instead of the main note I could get A-F#-E-F# and if cut ends the same instance the tap starts, I could get A-E-F#.

Thoughts?

-l2t

learn2turn wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:00 am And if the cut ends exactly when the tap occurs, that's another one less.

And that wouldn't be a roll.

A long roll (starting with the main note) will have five sounds (three main pitches and two blips). A short roll (starting with the cut) will have four. There are places where you'd want one and places where you'd the want the other, so valid contexts for both.

And that's before we even consider double cut rolls and other variants.

I left them out deliberately!

Peter Duggan wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:58 am

learn2turn wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:00 am And if the cut ends exactly when the tap occurs, that's another one less.

And that wouldn't be a roll.

A long roll (starting with the main note) will have five sounds (three main pitches and two blips). A short roll (starting with the cut) will have four. There are places where you'd want one and places where you'd the want the other, so valid contexts for both.

Thanks, learning on my own, it's good to have affirmation of what I'm trying. I like the 5 sound roll the best. I didn't really like the simultaneous end of cut, start of tap with the middle missing. I don't know anything about this stuff but it indeed didn't sound like a roll any more.

-l2t

There are a ton of great irish traditional musicians in MA who teach in person and online - I'd strongly suggest lessons.

Unique pitches? You mean the three "melody notes" of the roll count as one?

What's the reason for calculating that?

Don't think of rolls as notes; think of them as rhythmic elements, or articulations. You choose which roll based on what rhythmic effect you are trying to get.

I agree that lessons will save you lots of struggling.

Look up Stiamh's website, brother steve's whistle tutorial. It is very clear as an entry to understanding this stuff.

Of course, listen to the music. I kind of thought I could do rolls, but then I was blown away when I heard to Mary Bergin. Listening to lots of music will inform you that a standard long roll is only one way to do it.

Do yourself a favor and sign up for a free 14-day trial on OAIM: https://www.oaim.ie/tin-whistle/tin-whi ... undations/