Burke Session high D?

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:27 pm

I'd not want to learn that fingering (or thumbing I suppose) because it wouldn't make for a smooth transition should you decide you like another whistle down the line that doesn't have a thumb-hole option.... I think being familiar with the various cross fingerings for Cnat would be time better spent, but that's just me.

fancypiper · Post by **fancypiper** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:36 pm

I have often wondered why none of the whistle makers make a whistle that uses GHB fingering, I.E. 7 holes in the front and a thumbhole. One of these days I may waste some of my brass tubing or pvc pipe and see what that would sound like. At least, it should be easier to tune as it would only play 9 notes in one octave.

And, it would sound better than the out of tune practice chanters I have tried.

I had rather learn those Scottish tunes on one of those rather than playing A mixupedolodean on a D whistle. That mode is just mind blowing.

CranberryDog · Post by **CranberryDog** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 6:00 pm

straycat82 wrote:I'd not want to learn that fingering (or thumbing I suppose) because it wouldn't make for a smooth transition should you decide you like another whistle down the line that doesn't have a thumb-hole option.... I think being familiar with the various cross fingerings for Cnat would be time better spent, but that's just me.

You raise an excellent point. One would be without a paddle while attempting to play other make whistles.

HampshireWhistler · Post by **HampshireWhistler** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 6:42 pm

I've recently made the transition from an Oak classic D (which wasn't bad for a cheapie, I tweaked it some) to Burke Session High D and it is awesome! Excellent whistle. It really is as good as the sound samples. I highly recommend one.

izzarina · Post by **izzarina** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 7:10 pm

HampshireWhistler wrote: I highly recommend one.

PhilO · Post by **PhilO** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:59 pm

The two high D whistles I use day in and day out over time are Burke black tip brass and Abell delrin.

Philo

CranberryDog · Post by **CranberryDog** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 8:59 am

Thanks again for your contributons. I have decided to forego a thumb hole.

Yesterday, I called Song of the Sea and spoke with Eddie. I explained I was deciding on a soprano D. He was kind enough to play a few whistles over the phone; to include a Burke Session D (brass), a Copeland (nickel), and an Overton (aluminium).

They all sounded very good. I found that the Overton to have the most volume; however, Eddie thought that it also required the most breath; the Burke seemed to have the purest notes and required the least effort with the Copeland in the middle. If you were to choose, which would it be for playing sessions without a pa system. Thanks again.

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 9:07 am

Honestly, I'd chose which ever one has the tone you are looking for. Between those three whistles, volume at a session is not going to be an issue. Also, and it's been said many times but not everyone realizes it so it's worth repeating that, the other players/audience can usually hear the whistle better than you'd think. The things carry quite well and any of the three whistles you've mentioned would hold their own in a session. If you have issues hearing yourself then maybe try playing out the side of your mouth (closer to one ear)... some even wear a baseball cap sidways to help catch more of the sound in one ear. Really though, you don't need to be out in front of everyone as the loudest instrument.
I play sessions frequently and all I really ever use is a Generation, a Feadog or a Sindt and they can be heard just fine.

eskin · Post by **eskin** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 9:40 am

I used a Burke brass session D for nearly all the whistle videos on my site:

http://www.tradlessons.com

CranberryDog · Post by **CranberryDog** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 10:11 am

straycat82 wrote:Honestly, I'd chose which ever one has the tone you are looking for. Between those three whistles, volume at a session is not going to be an issue. Also, and it's been said many times but not everyone realizes it so it's worth repeating that, the other players/audience can usually hear the whistle better than you'd think. The things carry quite well and any of the three whistles you've mentioned would hold their own in a session. If you have issues hearing yourself then maybe try playing out the side of your mouth (closer to one ear)... some even wear a baseball cap sidways to help catch more of the sound in one ear. Really though, you don't need to be out in front of everyone as the loudest instrument.
I play sessions frequently and all I really ever use is a Generation, a Feadog or a Sindt and they can be heard just fine.

What you say makes perfect sense. I sometimes get caught up in the "thrill of the hunt and discovery" so to speak. When I finally make my selection, I settle down and deal with what is more important: playing.

I have played flamenco guitar for years and have found it true that one is best served by buying the best quality instrument that is within ones budget. This will generally get you better playability and tone.

I do wonder if a Copeland, for example, price-wise sounds 20 times better than say, a Generation or the like.

The volume issue has more to do with my partial hearing loss than standing out front. The baseball cap is not a bad suggestion. Best.

fancypiper · Post by **fancypiper** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 10:49 am

Most people think that the Clarke original design whistle is rather quiet. I had a tape recorder at a large session at the Swannanoa Gathering the first year they had it and it rained so much that we had to jam in the gym rather than the outside tents, I put my recorder just in front of Jerry O'Sullivan (and there were 4 more pipers there, plus some folks with loud expensive whistles. I was up in the bleachers near the back, so that I wouldn't bother anyone with all my mistakes (I thought), but when I got home and listened to the tapes, I had no problem picking out my whistle out of all the instruments.

I have found that it is harder to hear yourself live, but if you wear a large brimmed hat (I like a straw hat in the summer) like Paddy Keennan does, you can hear yourself better. Also, I play out of the side of my mouth so that the whistle is nearer my right ear and turn so that I hear everybody else out of my left ear. That seems to give the best "live" balance.

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 10:49 am

BTW, just to avoid misunderstanding, I'm not picking on you, just trying to offer some experience and insight

CranberryDog wrote:I do wonder if a Copeland, for example, price-wise sounds 20 times better than say, a Generation or the like.

That, my friend is where it gets personal. Ear of the beholder and all that. Many people are obsessed to a point about the idea that a more expensive whistle is a better whistle. Good for them if that's what they like... even I went through that as an inexperienced whistler. You need to find out what you like. For me, the pure sounding instruments are just a little bland. Much of the music I listen to was recorded before the likes of Burke, Copeland, and Overton so the "cheapie" is the sound I'm accustomed to and the sound I enjoy. It has the most character, IMO. You need to listen and figure out what it is that you like. If you like the pure sound then maybe a Copeland would be 20 times better for you. If you like a simple instrument with more quirks and character then maybe the Copeland would be a waste of your money. These are questions that many people can offer insight into but you are the only one who can answer it for yourself.
[for the record, I've never played a Copeland before and am not discouraging it, just using the example you provided]

CranberryDog wrote:The volume issue has more to do with my partial hearing loss than standing out front.

Keep in mind though that a session is a community event and you do need to be considerate of the other musicians. The fact that a guitar player is hard of hearing wouldn't give him the right to show up with an amplifier... going louder would benefit you but try and find a solution that won't have any negative effects for the rest of the group (the baseball cap or straw hat were great suggestions). I don't neccessarily see this as an issue with the whistle (they do only get so loud) but just something to think about in general as part of the session mentality and etiquette.

fancypiper · Post by **fancypiper** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 11:01 am

CranberryDog wrote:I do wonder if a Copeland, for example, price-wise sounds 20 times better than say, a Generation or the like.

No, IMHO.

Personally, I think the most "bang for the buck" whistle is the Clarke original design, but I usually buy several as they are untunable and some of them I can't blow into tune, even though they are in tune with themselves. Also, I like to have backups, because I tend to end up with a few "bannanna" whistles when I stick them in my back pocket and forget and sit down on them.

I play the Clarke as my first choice, and If the weather/gig/session doesn't allow for my straw hat, I use my Burke blacktip brass session pro, mainly so I can hear it better (getting old ears).

My third choice for more volume is the original Susato that a friend gave me, but I need sonic filters to play that beast. That is mostly at old time jams where there are several banjos and guitars and they request that I play louder.

Both the Burke and Susato don't have the sound quality that I like (they are too "sweet" or "pure") but the Clarke has that nice breathy traditional sound and the notes are eaiser to "blow" into tune with other instruments.

YMMV

CranberryDog · Post by **CranberryDog** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 11:14 am

I have been playing music for 40 years plus so I am quite aware of being considerate to other players. Of course, how would you know this. When I play flamenco guitar, I play acoustically, some soloing and some dance accompaniment. I don't recall doing "Purple Haze" through a Marshall stack.

Anyway, I have some high frequency hearing loss I believe came from playing in pipe bands. Many indoor practices with up to 12 pipers and 8 drummers can leave your ears ringing.

I certainly appreciate your time in replying. I played whistle several years ago and I am attempting to get back in it. I have found that the good old stand-by inexpensive whistles are still out there as well as the high end makes that I am learning about.

From your excellent feedback, I believe the Burke will be my re-entry vehicle. Best.

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 11:34 am

CranberryDog wrote:Anyway, I have some high frequency hearing loss I believe came from playing in pipe bands. Many indoor practices with up to 12 pipers and 8 drummers can leave your ears ringing.

Oh dear! That'll definitely do it.

I doubt you'll be disappointed in a Burke. As far as high-end pure whistles go it is definitely worth it's price. There's no wait time for it and they're consistent so you'll have yourself a good whistle in no time. Even beyond that, if you decide it's not for you then they are popular enough that you'll have no problem getting most of your money back should you decide to sell it and try something else.

Good luck!