Question about types of whistles for sessions

[Steve Bliven]

I've had a couple of folks suggest to me that wooden whistles and/or other "designer" whistles are looked down on for sessions by traditional Irish whistlers. Have you seen this in your experience in sessions? If so, is it universal or only in certain sessions or certain geographic areas or certain populations?

Caveat: my interest is in better understanding the session mind-set, not to start any sort of unpleasantness between advocates of various types, brands, or makers of whistles. Just looking for your experience, not whether any such bias is right or wrong.

Best wishes.

Steve

[NicoMoreno]

I haven't really seen any overt hostility in my neck of the woods.

However if someone shows up with an expensive (not just wooden) whistle, it's almost always a sign that they aren't any good at irish music, either because they're just a beginner, or they're an instrument collector, but not really someone who plays a lot. The exceptions to that are Sindts, the occasional O'Riordan, and maybe 50% of Burke owners. And Brad Hurley.

That has been my experience anyway!

[straycat82]

My experience pretty much mirrors Nico's. I've never looked down on another whistler for their choice of instrument but I have noticed that the fancier whistles are usually toted by those with less experience... especially the ones who line up every whistle they own across the table in some sort of proud display. I've noticed the same for music camps and workshops.
The comment on Sindts and 50/50 Burkes was spot on as well in my experience.
It also seems that the best whistle players are usually pipers or flute players who also carry a cheapo or Sindt whistle in their case as an afterthought to the flute or pipes.

[Achill]

In my experience I've noticed some of the more accomplished players who truly know the music are playing whistles under 20 bucks and can sound incredible, non-fancy D whistle without any bells and whistles... uh, you know what I mean:)
A friend that plays here, perhaps one of the best I've heard in the area, has said that a reason he chose to learn the whistle (aside from loving the music) was due to not having any money to purchase a different trad instrument. I would bet that many of the folks, young and old, in Ireland can relate. Those things (whistles) are kids toys over there from a young age, 7 year olds are not playing anything fancy and many of them (o.k. most) would blow us away here.
Cheers:)

[brewerpaul]

I always bring a Busman or two with me and other players always seem interested in them. FWIW I'm a pretty competent but not expert player. I see Abells, Sindts, Burkes and the like too as well as a decent selection of the mass produced ones.

[pancelticpiper]

Seems to me that this has changed quite a bit over the years.

When I started playing in the mid 1970's it seems like all the "real" Irish whistle players (Irish born & raised, very serious about the music, very good players) that I encountered played a brass Generation D with a red top. As best I can recall, Generations were the only D's available at the time (Clarkes only came in C then).

Then in the late 70's and early 80's a lot of American makers began making D whistles: Susato, Ralph Sweet, etc. These were normally seen in the hands of people who had recorders lurking in their bags; the serious Irish players stayed with their Generations.

My impression is that that situation has mostly changed, with many serious Irish players using American-made "designer" whistles.

[talasiga]

[X, Y and Z] are looked down on for sessions by traditional Irish whistlers
........

I keep on seeing comments like this about session elites.
Is it because they have nothing to look up to?

[FJohnSharp]

I'm an okay player and when I go to a new session I always pull out the Oak first and leave the Burke in the bag for a while until I gauge the group. The very last thing I want is to have someone say something like, 'Nice whistle--too bad he can't play it."

[straycat82]

Nothing to be ashamed of for having a nice instrument. It's a shame to think that any player would put another down for spending a mere $200 on an instrument. Especially when that wouldn't even begin to buy a nice filddle, flute, etc.
Still though, you can usually spot the ones who are more about their whistle than they are about playing their whistle.

*Edited for clarity (hopefully)

[Tim2723]

I've never encountered any hostility, but it's fair to say that I've known a few players who sought more status and admiration from ownership than they did through playing well. I've also known those who believed that buying an expensive instrument would magically improve their playing. They were consitently mistaken. This observation extends far beyond whistles.

[MTGuru]

My experience here in SoCal echoes Nico and straycat, and the other posters here. I see Cheapies, Sindts and Burkes, an occasional Abell or Copeland. I've never actually seen an O'Riordan in the wild.

I've been scolded once for playing a fancy whistle, at a conservative session, by a very conservative player.

[Bloomfield]

Nothing to be ashamed of for having a nice instrument. It's a shame that other players would put you down for spending a mere $200 on an instrument. Especially when that wouldn't even begin to buy a nice filddle, flute, etc.
Still though, you can usually spot the ones who are more about their whistle than they are about playing their whistle.

Where do you get the "put down" notion?

What Nico said is that expensive whistles are often "a sign" that the musician isn't very good at Irish trad music. It doesn't follow that such players are "put down" at a session. The only time I have seen players put down at session (and it happens no more often than you see people put down over dinner conversations) is when they behaved in an inconsiderate or selfish way. Lack of consideration for others can be both musical and otherwise at sessions, of course.

[straycat82]

My comment was a generalization based on comments I've heard in the past related to this issue and what I've seen/heard firsthand at sessions (though not commonly). The post you referenced had nothing to do with Nico's post. If you read further up you'll see that Nico and I were already on the same page. I wasn't arguing or disagreeing with anyone here; I think you might have read a bit too much into my generalized statement. I'm with you fellas

[MTGuru]

Where do you get the "put down" notion?

Well, the rebuke I cited above was very public and very vocal, in earshot of the other players. Along the lines of "anyone (me) who pays more than $5 for a whistle is a fool." It was partly a (grossly ineffective) attempt to educate, and mostly a case of an alpha session male marking his territory. It happens.

[talasiga]

.......
What Nico said is that expensive whistles are often "a sign" that the musician isn't very good at Irish trad music. It doesn't follow that such players are "put down" at a session.
......

prejudiced V condescending.
Yes, you're right - there is a distinction.