question from a newbie -- flute vs. whistle

sling · Post by **sling** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 12:43 pm

Hi everyone! I've had fun lurking around this forum for a bit but finally signed up. I think I have gotten WhOA, because I am looking into buying another whistle. Here's a brief history so you can understand my question... I bought my first whistle about 18 months ago and bought my second about 2 months ago. The first was a Clarke Sweetone and the second is a Waltons, both soprano D's. I play for my own amusement in my basement with no one listening. That's probably as far as it will ever go. I've been happy with both whistles since I just play for the heck of it by myself in my basement with no one listening.

I want to buy another whistle... a low D whistle. I have looked around on this forum and have decided on either a Susato or a Dixon. Both are cheap but seem like they will suit my minimal purposes.

Ok, FINALLY here is my question -- the idea of buying a Dixon with the dual head (flute and whistle) is appealing to me. But my question is most basic. What is the difference between playing the Dixon with the flute head and playing it with the whistle head? I understand there is a volume difference, but is there a sound quality difference or any other kind of difference? I have played the flute (the metal kind students learn to play in school) for 20 years, so a flute, and the whistle for that matter, is not new to me.

Any thoughts or words of wisdom are appreciated!

IDAwHOa · Post by **IDAwHOa** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 1:46 pm

There are whistles that sound a lot like flutes. I have played two: Burke Composite and a Goldie made Overton. I currently own the Overton and when Renee and I were playing a couple of days ago (me on the Overton and her on her Bleazey flute) I noticed an incredible similarity to the sound.

The flute does have a bit of a volume advantage, as well as being a bit more expressive. It does take quite a bit more work to get those from the flute though. Oh, and although there are some nice ones in a decent price range, they are typically a bit more expensive as well.

As far as the low d whistle goes, I would look into a Kerry or Howard. Both are superior to the two you mention, in my estimation. I am trying to think of other sub-$100 low d's too. Jubilee maybe? HELP?

Wormdiet · Post by **Wormdiet** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 2:54 pm

If you want to try playing flute, get something intended to be a flute - not a whistle with an alternate headpiece. From experience, I prefer the Tipple to the 2-piece Dixon flute. It is easier to play and sounds better. A bit more of a stretch though.

sling · Post by **sling** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 3:31 pm

I think I am deciding then, that I'll just go with the low D whistle since that is what I really wanted anyway. I just saw that for just a little bit more money I could buy a whistle that comes with a flute head too and thought I might as well. Sounds like I'd be happier putting that extra money into an even better whistle. If I decide to really get into flute some time, I'll just buy a flute.

sling · Post by **sling** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 4:49 pm

So flute vs. whistle -- The sound is in essence the same, but varies in terms of control, expression and volume?

tin tin · Post by **tin tin** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:06 pm

So flute vs. whistle -- The sound is in essence the same, but varies in terms of control, expression and volume?

A well-played flute sounds significantly different from a (low) whistle. A flute obviously sounds more like a low whistle than a trumpet does, seeing as both transverse flutes and whistles are in the same family of instruments, but they're quite distinct.

DCrom · Post by **DCrom** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 6:22 pm

And - returning to the Dixon 2-piece issue - I think you're making the right choice in getting something else (if you're interested in flute, though the Dixon is a good beginner's whistle).

I did get the Dixon 2-piece a couple of years ago, in part because I wanted to try flute. Not a bad low whistle (not my favorite, now, but OK), but not a great flute (probably worth the extra $15 or so if you're already buying the Dixon tunable low whistle, but not much more). I didn't realize how lacking it was as a flute until I finally got a real flute (a Burns Folk Flute - still pretty inexpensive) and was blown away by the improvement.

The Dixon isn't a bad low whistle (though I like my Howard Low D more), but the flute head is mostly an afterthought. I can play it, but the tone and ease of play of every "real" flute I've tried make it an exercise in frustration.

If you want to try flute without spending too much money, a lot of folks here recommend the Tipple PVC flutes (<$100); if you want a conical-bore flute, there are quite a few decent keyless offerings (Burns, Sweetheart, Dixon 3-piece, Seery, M & E) in the $400 or less category.

Black Mage · Post by **Black Mage** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:21 pm

I own a Dixon low D and I really like it. It's afforable, so it's good for a first low D, plus the finger stretch isn't as extreme as, say, a Burke (on which I can't ever reach that bottom D). It also has low air requirements, so you won't run out of breath quickly.

The only complaint I have is that I get burried while playing in sessions, I can't even hear myself. But seeing as how you prefer to just play for your own enjoyment (which I think is still a great reason to play, if not the best reason) then a Dixon would probably be a good start.

DCrom · Post by **DCrom** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 8:48 pm

Black Mage wrote:I own a Dixon low D and I really like it. It's afforable, so it's good for a first low D, plus the finger stretch isn't as extreme as, say, a Burke (on which I can't ever reach that bottom D). It also has low air requirements, so you won't run out of breath quickly.

The only complaint I have is that I get burried while playing in sessions, I can't even hear myself. But seeing as how you prefer to just play for your own enjoyment (which I think is still a great reason to play, if not the best reason) then a Dixon would probably be a good start.

As I said, I think the Dixon is a good beginner's whistle. And the low volume is a plus for late night practice if you have a family or close neighbors.

But even though I've got fairly small hands for a man, once I learned piper's grip I've never encounted a Low D whistle that I had trouble with. You can get away with playing the Dixon with the standard "high whistle" grip, but it's worth the effort to master piper's grip - once you've got it down, you should be able to play just about anything.

sling · Post by **sling** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:31 pm

The grip is the thing that concerns me the most because I've played classical flute for so many years. I'm so used to the nicely curved fingers and fingertip keying. BUT it's all part of the learning I guess. I've tried my best to always play flat fingered at the second joint when playing my whistle, but 20 years worth of habits die hard!

clark · Post by **clark** » Tue Dec 13, 2005 5:05 am

You don't have to play a flute "flat fingered" (pipers fingering I presume you mean). You play with the pads of the fingers distal to the first joint - just like an open holed modern flute. Now, I know a Boehm player who has plugged the holes in her open hole flute and plays with her fingers just on the edge of the keys. When she has tried one of my flutes she cannot seem to close any the holes to save her life.

Clark

sling · Post by **sling** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 2:25 pm

I went ahead and bought a Dixon low D and have had it for 2 weeks (?) now. I LOVE it! It did in fact, take me a while to get used to the piper's grip and getting that darned low D, but after just a little practice, it plays as naturally as my soprano whistle. I even played a little song at a Christmas Eve service! Thanks for everyone's help and advice!

bjs · Post by **bjs** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:11 am

Isn't the point of a flute that it is a more expressive instrument? In particular it can produce quiet high notes. The downside is it's a lot harder to learn to play. After 5 years whistle I bought a tiple flute. sometimes I can play a tune and sometimes I can't find a note, just the sound of wind blowing oh and breath runs out pretty quickly too.

I have a Dixon low D whistle. After a while it aint too hard to cover the holes. Seems difficult at first. Not a lot of breath needed. Great for a quiet tootal at home.

DCrom · Post by **DCrom** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:53 pm

bjs wrote:Isn't the point of a flute that it is a more expressive instrument? In particular it can produce quiet high notes. The downside is it's a lot harder to learn to play. After 5 years whistle I bought a tiple flute. sometimes I can play a tune and sometimes I can't find a note, just the sound of wind blowing oh and breath runs out pretty quickly too.

I have a Dixon low D whistle. After a while it aint too hard to cover the holes. Seems difficult at first. Not a lot of breath needed. Great for a quiet tootal at home.

Not knocking the low whistle (I still play mine, too) but though the flute embouchure takes a little while to develop, it's not impossibly difficult by any means. And once you start to develop it, the amount of air needed goes way down.

At this point, I'll admit that my Dixon Low D needs less breath than my Burns Folk Flute - but the flute's on par with my Howard Low D and older-model Serpent Low F.

At this point (about 3 months into it) I can play just about any piece I can manage on low whistle equally well (or not) on the flute, and the upper end of the the second octave is, if anything, easier on flute (certainly better balanced). There are pros and cons for both - low whistle needs (I think) better breath control in the upper octave, but flute seems to need more focus to play well - when my concentration slips, so does my tone.

I'm not knocking low whistle (as I said, I still play mine and I have no plans to sell them), but I didn't want flute to appear harder than it is, either.

amar · Post by **amar** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:57 pm

The Dixon lowD was my first lowD. Personally, I would always chose the Dixon over the Susato. Due to sound, and to fingering.