Not OT, PC : the sound of recorders vs whistles

[kevin m.]

I'd bet that you'd get a better balance between octaves than on ANY whistle(NOT a criticism of Whistles),if you were to use that back hole,Zub.That's what it's there for,after 700 plus years (think of a number) of Recorder development.
I ALMOST wrote a piece called 'Born again Whistler' this afternoon,as I'm thinking of rationalising my music making back to the instrument that actually got me PLAYING something,ANYTHING(!) again after too many years of doing nothing.

[dubhlinn]

Aah,gawon,gawon,gawon
Slan,
(Hic,)
D.

[kevin m.]

Aah,gawon,gawon,gawon
Slan,
(Hic,)
D.

Not now,I'm off to see me auld maw,see if me sister's new (mew?) Cat has has been found after going walk about,etc,etc,so stay tuned to this station.
In the meantime,if you're readin' Mrs. D,any trouble,just club 'im wid the Generation Bb!!!!

[Loren]

Big foreword for a short sequel: I'd challenge anyone here to tell their sound in a blindfold test from a good whistle.

Challenge accepted! Of course this has to be done in person as recording colors the sound too much.

Loren

[kevin m.]

Right Dubh,I'm back (unfortunatly,the Cat isn't),and I've posted me confession.
Hopefully the Bb Gen. doesn't bear too many dents!!!

[dreamerlass]

I like recorders...I played one for years...I just got a whistle, and I love it too. And it's not weird fingering.

[bearbro]

I've been reading some of the posts here about recorders, with remarks like. "There cheap plastic things", "Cannot get the second octave", "Takes to much wind to play", "There toys for kinds", as well as a bunch of other things. The truth is all the above can be said about Whistles also. Yes even the "cheap plastic" remark. As I have several "Cheap plastic" whistles.

If the truth be known there are good whistles & recorders as well as bad whistles & recorders. I have recorders that sound like my cat passing wind but I also have whistles that sound the same way. (Mostly the cheap ones, although not always so). And I have recorders & whistles that brings joy to ones heart just to hear them sing. I also have recorders & whistles that sound the same.

I thought whistle players where more open minded people then some of the posts I have read here. Be nice people, be nice..........

[Zubivka]

Big foreword for a short sequel: I'd challenge anyone here to tell their sound in a blindfold test from a good whistle.

Challenge accepted! Of course this has to be done in person as recording colors the sound too much.

Loren

You're quite right. So, when's the next flight from Boston MA to Nantes, France?

Seriously, the recent ITM festival in Mesquer (my village) had something of a Foky-Gruber rally with two Silverton D whistles (which btw happen to play totally identically) and one Silberton C blockflöte thing in German fingering style. A known "baroque" (pignose) didn't cross the channel.
There are minor sound differences, the recorder having smaller top holes and a bigger bore than the D whistle, but the sound colours are the same: whistle, not baroque recorder.
Play it in D minor, and no-one could tell it's not a whistle playing. And I'm talking here about extremely apt whistle players... and one maker. Of course, being no recorder players, they reached the second register by overblowing, not venting it (which surely would tell the tale).
I wouldn't be surprised of some reverse engineering on the way...

[brewerpaul]

Hey, they DO come in D, you know.

The size called a "voice flute" is in D, same pitch as our low D whistle.

And fully-chromatic, too, people . . . come on, you KNOW you want one.

Stuart

Not exactly right... the naming of keys of recorders vs whistles is a bit confusing.
On a D whistle (low or high) D is the lowest note, and the basic fundamental scale that this instrument plays by basically taking one finger off at a time is a D scale. Easy and sensible
On a C recorder (soprano or tenor) the basic fundamental scale is ALSO a D scale! These two recorders are pitched like a D and low D whistle respectively. The C that gives them their designation is just tacked onto the bottom of that D scale (also a C#). I think there are a couple of whistle makers who offer this as an option.
A voice flute in D has D as the lowest "tacked on note", so the actual fundamental scale is in C. While you can buy first rate inexpensive plastic C recorders, nobody makes plastic voice flutes. For the price of a wooden one, you could buy a LOT of whistles...

[kevin m.]

As BrewerPaul says,the 'C' Recorder is directly comparable to a simple system or 'Irish' Flute with a 'C' Foot.
The Primary scale of the instrument is 'D'.

[Daniel_Bingamon]

If you at the development of many woodwind instruments, you'll find that the D base note is an important part of their development. Many of the lower notes were tacked on for the pinky fingers.

I'm trying to remember the note that the ring finger plays on the clarinet (concert note, not transposed), is it 'D'?

BTW - That ballot wasn't written in West Palm Beach was it?

[treeshark]

I enjoy both recorders and whistles, and depending on the instrument they can sound very similar. One thing I have found tho is that my renaissance soprano recorder by Von Heune has a faster response time than any of my whisles so I can play it a fair bit quicker. The Von Heune also addresses the great pepper mill controversy!! As for wierd fingering I'm just learning the 3rd octave on the 8 key flute which is definately weird.

[Walden]

Hey, they DO come in D, you know.

The size called a "voice flute" is in D, same pitch as our low D whistle.

And fully-chromatic, too, people . . . come on, you KNOW you want one.

Stuart

Not exactly right... the naming of keys of recorders vs whistles is a bit confusing.
On a D whistle (low or high) D is the lowest note, and the basic fundamental scale that this instrument plays by basically taking one finger off at a time is a D scale. Easy and sensible
On a C recorder (soprano or tenor) the basic fundamental scale is ALSO a D scale! These two recorders are pitched like a D and low D whistle respectively. The C that gives them their designation is just tacked onto the bottom of that D scale (also a C#). I think there are a couple of whistle makers who offer this as an option.
A voice flute in D has D as the lowest "tacked on note", so the actual fundamental scale is in C. While you can buy first rate inexpensive plastic C recorders, nobody makes plastic voice flutes. For the price of a wooden one, you could buy a LOT of whistles...

Yes, the most basic scale on a C rec***er is D, but for it to correspond with the fingering of a D whistle, I'd think a German system rec***er would be closer than the Baroque/English system.

[kevin m.]

The way I understand it,the 'German' fingering system is inherently out of tune.
Best stick with 'Baroque' fingering,even if the F# and F natural fingerings take some getting used to at first (and differ in the first and second octaves to boot!).

[Walden]

Best stick with 'Baroque' fingering,even if the F# and F natural fingerings take some getting used to at first (and differ in the first and second octaves to boot!).

I agree, and have always used Baroque-system recorders, I just meant that the allusion to C recorders as like D whistles with an extra note at bottom applies more to German.