making a D song into a G song

[Jack]

I have a few songs that go down to C and B below D, and they're in the key of D, and I'd like to make them G because soimebody said that'd make them more playable. If you just changed all the C#s into Cnats, that would make it into a G song, no? I know that's not what you have to do, though, because it doesn't change the lower notes.

Be easy with me..transposing isn't my middle name.

[Zubivka]

If you transpose by ear and your song started from D, just start from G. Etc.

Scale of G : G A B C D E F# g
Instead of: D E F# G A B C# d

If you start from sheet music, then transpose note for note as shown with the two scales above.

Now, ideally, instead of making the D tune into a G tune (i.e. transposing one fourth up) you would play it on a A whistle.
This way you'll stick to the true untransposed tonality (D tune) you've heard or read the music in, but you get these low B and C you miss on a D whistle.

Incidentally, playing the D scale on a A whistle takes the exact same fingering as transposing to G on a D whistle...

[Jack]

If you transpose by ear and your song started from D, just start from G. Etc.

Scale of G : G A B C D E F# g
Instead of: D E F# G A B C# d

If you start from sheet music, then transpose note for note as shown with the two scales above.

Now, ideally, instead of making the D tune into a G tune (i.e. transposing one fourth up) you would play it on a A whistle.
This way you'll stick to the true untransposed tonality (D tune) you've heard or read the music in, but you get these low B and C you miss on a D whistle.

Incidentally, playing the D scale on a A whistle takes the exact same fingering as transposing to G on a D whistle...

Thanks. That makes sense. I should have known that.

I should just buy an A whistle...

[mrosenlof]

You're on the right track, this is transposing. You get good at it eventually.

Before you change all the C# to C natural, you need to play all the notes a 4th higher. So a written D you play as G, a written E you play as A, a written F# you play as B, a written G you play as C nat, A as D, so on.

So basically, move all the notes up two lines on the staff, change the key sig to the key of G.

[Joe]

I find the easiest wayto work this out is as follows.
If you play the tune on a G whistle with your standard D whistle fingering the tune will be in G. Now if you work out what notes your actually playing on the G whistle you can work out the fingering on the D whistle to play in G - does that make sense?
So for a D to G transposition you get:-

D Notes - c# B A G F# E D
G Notes - f# e d C B A G

This may sound a bit of a simplistic approach but I find it easier to work with whistles rather than dots.
Joe

[mrosenlof]

OK, someone beat me to it.

Cran,

Buying an A whistle doesn't do the job all by itself. You still need to put your fingers in different places to play the notes as written.

[morgan]

This is a REAL quote from Mr. Kelischek, who makes Susatos. I heard it myself:

(Begin German accent)

"Zeez folk musicians only zay want to play in D. Zay say play a D, und a D, und unnuhzer D, und 99 more D's, und zen an A, und zen nussing at all!"

(End German accent)

As you can see, folk musicians have some music theory work to do before gaining the respect of the classical music world.

[skh]

Cran,

do you know your way around a piano? Then it is easy. Take a piece of paper and draw the keys of a piano on it, with black and white keys, and no black key between b and c, and e and f.

Now look for the note the tune is in, and count from there to the key you want it to be in. If it's in D and you want G, it is: "D-D#-E-F-F#-G". Now take every note in the tune, count up the same number of half tones (do not skip the black keys, just count them in), and write down the result. You'll end up with the right accidentals that way, and it is a purely "mathematical" way to do it.

After a while, you can do it in your head, but visualizing the piano keys helps in getting the exact number of half tones right.

Does that help?

Sonja

[picardy third]

This question has brought up a question in my mind. Have any whistle makers made (or tried making) a modal instrument? Instead of the traditional Ionian scale, are there any made specially for say Dorian, Phrygian, or Aeolian scales? I guess in the context of D major, an A would serve as almost a Mixolydian instrument. But what if you just did not want to play on an A instrument. Say the lowest not in the piece was a C# and your are wealthy enough and anal enough to have a C# Locrian instrument made. I know this is a silly situation and quite impractical; I just want to know if it has been done. Please forgive me for my silly-ness.

picardy

[Zubivka]

This question has brought up a question in my mind. Have any whistle makers made (or tried making) a modal instrument? Instead of the traditional Ionian scale, are there any made specially for say Dorian, Phrygian, or Aeolian scales? I guess in the context of D major, an A would serve as almost a Mixolydian instrument. But what if you just did not want to play on an A instrument. Say the lowest not in the piece was a C# and your are wealthy enough and anal enough to have a C# Locrian instrument made. I know this is a silly situation and quite impractical; I just want to know if it has been done. Please forgive me for my silly-ness.

picardy

Not that silly at all, if the tubes are cheap enough. And bingo: see our fellow Chiffer Daniel Bingamon's site . At a few dollars a tube--and I understood, he'll make some for others' heads if asked--can you miss?

At a premium, I understand that Ronaldo Reyburn now offers a choice of minor modes (ever tried to play harmonic minor on a regular whistle? )

Also, if you like tricky things, ask for a 10-hole (chromatic) whistle, for instance from Colin Goldie. You can always half-hole for quarter tones!

Finally, re***ers are minor whistles, hee-hee: any regular C redorker plays naturally dorian D with whistle fingering, and will do any minor scale easily if you stick your right pinky up its pig's nose.


PS: what do you mean by a Mixolydian instrument? I thought any regular D whistle is mixolydian A if starting from A, and any G whistle would play mixo D?
Or do you mean as bagpipe chanter with one extra hole one full tone below key? Then you'd just need a whistle with a seventh hole...

[hillfolk22]

I know the question was from D to G...
However, as long as you know how many sharps or flats make up a certain key, you can transpose any key over to G or D

I prefer to use my fingers.... ok, sometimes I count on my fingers as well.

The hillfolk coming out of me.

Say for instance. D is your thumb, you go up the scale starting with D, E, F, G,....then G is your ring finger.... so then all the notes are counted the same way. Four steps up. So a B on the scale of D counted up from the thumb turns into an E on the scale of G...and so and so and so forth.

I do this alot when transposing chords. After awhile, you get use to what the 5th and 6th... chords are to a certain scale.

Hope this helps. Lots of great suggestions.... one of them should work well with you.

Laura

[picardy third]

PS: what do you mean by a Mixolydian instrument? I thought any regular D whistle is mixolydian A if starting from A, and any G whistle would play mixo D?

Your absolutely right. A D whistle plays E dorian if you start on E, or F# Phrygian if you start on F#, etc. I'm talking about a whistle that would, say, start on E (E being the lowest note) and play an E dorian scale on up the tube. So with my previous comment about the A whistle, it is a whistle that starts on A and plays all of the notes of A mixolydian (same tones as a D major scale) except that the 7th of the A major would need to be flattened to make A mixolydian. As we all know this is quite easy on a whistle. So I figure a mixolydian instrument would probably be kind of a silly request. But then again the other modes would be silly requests also. Except, like you said, harmonic minor scales, Japanese scales, and others may be handy every once in a while. I assume with those we would be stepping out of traditional Celtic music. Of course, there is nothing traditional about a modal instrument, anyway. At least, I don't think Generation ever made an C# Locrian instument!

[Bloomfield]

Making D tunes into G tunes is really easy. It's hard to explain, though. So here are a couple of examples:

1. The Drunken Landlady
In D: The Drunken Landlady
In G: The Grunken Langlagy

2. Dinny Delaney's
In D: Dinny Delaney's
In G: Ginny Gelaney's
(this one is actually a bit more advanced, because you don't know if it should be Ginny as is Gary or Ginny as in Gerry. It comes with experience.)

3. The Rambling Boys of Pleasure
In D: The Rambling Boys of Pleasure
In G: ???
This is the exception. A tune that can't be turned into a G tune. At least on the whistle. You could do it on a figgle, though.

HTH

[picardy third]

Zubivka,
I just went to the jubilee instrument site. That is really cool. I didn't really think anyone would be making modal instruments! I don't really want one or need one, but my question has been answered. Thanks a lot!
picardy

[Jack]

I don't really want one or need one

Yes, you do. You know you do. Don't fight it.