Hard blow versus soft blow

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bruce.b
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Tell us something.: I’m a whistle, fiddle and tenor guitar player. Mostly low D, mostly Irish trad, but I’ll try any fiddle tune on whistle.

Re: Hard blow versus soft blow

Post by bruce.b »

((I also found the clogging issues go the opposite way around ... the MK clogs like crazy no matter how well warmed up, the Goldie only needs clearing between tune sets. It's possible this is related to the amount of effort a particular pair of lungs needs to make.))

It’s comments like this that convince me there is more going on with clogging issues than we realize. I clog Goldie low D’s constantly, and my MK hardly clogs at all if I warm it up first. It’s a dramatic difference. In general, MKs don’t have a reputation for clogging, for an all metal whistle, while Goldies do have a reputation for having clogging issues. Interestingly, I have two MK low D’s, a black one and a silver one. The silver one never clogs if it’s warmed up, but the black one does if I don’t keep it warm and don’t quickly blow it out between tunes. I just treated it with dish detergent this morning in fact, the first time I’ve ever treated an MK whistle, and I’ve been playing them for years. I don’t understand what the differences are between the two of them as they play and sound the same to me. I also have an MK F and a Midgie, and they don’t clog much either.

I also find the tone and playability of the MK’s to be the best of all the whistles I’ve played. I find the low D MK’s to be incredibly consistent too, both tone wise and playability wise.
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pancelticpiper
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Re: Hard blow versus soft blow

Post by pancelticpiper »

Dougrout wrote: Wed May 31, 2023 9:43 pm My Susato mezzo A requires a real push at the top of the second octave...
Over the years I've owned three Susato mezzo A whistles.

They had three different bore sizes, and the bore size had the expected results for each.

The best player by far was the one with the narrowest bore. I think it was the tubing that they generally use for their High D's.

The high notes were incredibly sweet, yet the low notes were full enough, for me. It was perfectly in tune in both octaves.

Generally Susatos have a loud, though civilised, 2nd octave however Susato have used many different bore sizes over the years. The biggest-bore Susatos do have "shouty" and slightly stiff high notes. I've only seen this with some of their High and Mezzo whistles. All the Susato Low Whistles I've owned have been good players.
Richard Cook
c1980 Quinn uilleann pipes
1945 Starck Highland pipes
Goldie Low D whistle
Moof
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Re: Hard blow versus soft blow

Post by Moof »

bruce.b wrote: Sat Jun 03, 2023 3:24 pm It’s comments like this that convince me there is more going on with clogging issues than we realize ... Interestingly, I have two MK low D’s, a black one and a silver one. The silver one never clogs if it’s warmed up, but the black one does if I don’t keep it warm and don’t quickly blow it out between tunes. I just treated it with dish detergent this morning in fact, the first time I’ve ever treated an MK whistle, and I’ve been playing them for years. I don’t understand what the differences are between the two of them as they play and sound the same to me.
Odd, isn't it – mine's barely playable. I keep trying with it, as I'm a very inexperienced player and that's almost certainly part of it, but I haven't cracked it yet.

I do clog the Goldie more when I'm fatigued due to my chronic illness. I think I go at it a bit hard when I'm tired, and my diaphragm's probably tensed up. If I switch to a plastic whistle that only needs half the air for a time, I can sometimes go back to the Goldie and find it's now okay because I've relaxed.

The MK is a harder blow for an asthmatic, so it's possible that it's the level of effort needed in the upper register that's behind some of the clogging. But I will get more whistle-fit eventually, I've not yet been playing a year. (I thought already being swimming-fit might help due to the need for controlled breathing, but it seems the answer to that is Not In The Slightest.)
bruce.b
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Tell us something.: I’m a whistle, fiddle and tenor guitar player. Mostly low D, mostly Irish trad, but I’ll try any fiddle tune on whistle.

Re: Hard blow versus soft blow

Post by bruce.b »

I wonder if clogging is something to do with individual body chemistry. Perhaps wet blowers just have something in their breath that causes more clogging by causing moisture to bead up in the windway/bevel. I believe everyone has roughly the same moisture content in the breath coming from their lungs.

The main difference for me as far as clogging is room temperature. If the room is warm I have few problems, if the room is cold all my whistles will clog. The Goidie is the exception, that clogs in all conditions, but I haven’t treated it with dish soap or toothpaste. It’s essentially a new whistle still, just several hours of playing. I have recently mostly been playing my high D Midgie, and very rarely my low D MK.. I love the whistle, both its tone and playability. I just got a Humphrey High D narrow bore Joirneyman. It’s tone is very different from the Midgie, much purer. It’s great too. The head is delrin and it clogs just like the Midgie, meaning no problems if the room is warm, but tends to clog when it’s cold in the room. Both whistles are just ok if I keep them warm when the room is cold. I haven’t found the material the whistle head is made out of to make a difference with clogging. Temp is everything.
Moof
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Re: Hard blow versus soft blow

Post by Moof »

bruce.b wrote: Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:55 am I haven’t found the material the whistle head is made out of to make a difference with clogging.
Again, my experience is completely the opposite! :lol: Weird. I have an all-plastic whistle that's virtually impossible to clog, and on the odd occasion it does, it blows out without the need to stop. My plastic-head Howard clogs very little, though with a narrower windway it will do it occasionally. Temperature doesn't seem to make a big difference with plastic heads, they warm up almost immediately regardless of the season.

With aluminium composite, low temperatures definitely make it worse. Not a lot, though, in the case of the MK; it could hardly get much worse than being unable to get through both parts of a 32-bar reel without stopping, even after thoroughly warming it up. The Goldie will clog easily when cold, but as the metal body is thinner, it warms up faster. I suspect I'll have slightly more issues with it come the winter, as I have to practise in a more or less unheated space.

I can't really play high whistle because the pitch hurts my ears, so I don't have much experience with very small-bodied instruments. Mid-G is as high as I go.
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