Marino waltz

[Flexismart]

While I use octave folding on flute and whistle - mostly in tunes that are in faster rhythms, I've found, by listening to countless recordings of myself and others, that folding on slow tunes is distracting and ill suited to making the point of the phrase. Further, I've found that folding on notes that are not native to the instrument are even worse, such as accidentals, or even Cnat, which can vary wildly on whistles due to makers construction, air pressure, finger placement, and prior note sequence.

As you know this technique is unique to these instruments and must be used judiciously - and even go so far as to eliminate the note completely in order to keep from drawing attention to an out of place or sour note. When playing with another instrument that can produce the note IE: accordion, fiddle - it's far easier to let them, especially in slow tunes, sound the note in an instant rather than try to 'fake' or fold it. My experience informs me that if I can produce an accurate harmonic, the tune flows and is heard as an enhancement, rather than an 'oops'.

As you've said this technique takes some skill and experience. But as I've said, in my earlier post, if you play the tune and substitute the notes as I've indicated, I think you will hear that they are suitable and not complex.

All this said - Thanks for your careful and knowledgable moderation - it's a big help in a sea of opinion.

[an seanduine]

Totally OT. Ballyjamesduff, huh? My wife's people come from there. When we finally tracked the cousin's down, we found they had come down there from the North four hundred years ago. Seems the folks there refer to the family still as 'the new people'. . .

Bob

[MTGuru]

Totally OT. Ballyjamesduff, huh?

OT? I'll say!

[Mr.Gumby]

So we're back to the discussion of "hard core" ITM again?

Best wishes.

Steve
(Editor of County Clare's Feakle Matters)

Hehe.. No, not really. It's about fuel.

To be honest my first reaction to the OP was to post a comment : 'For some reason I suddenly feel like lighting the fire'. which I didn't because that would have derailed the thing from the get go. To be honest the tune is so closely associated with the commercial that I have never played it (or heard it played) other than on nights where the company descended into silliness, ending up playing tunes from tv commercials or themes from tv series (like the Glenroe one, which itself is a speeded up version of the Glen Nephin Cuckoo, Cuichín Gleann Neifin)

MT got it right with the Bord na Mona reference but failed when making the distinction between Bord na Mona briquettes (as advertised), made from industrially harvested peat ( 'Bord na Mona, turning the Midlands into a brown desert/moonscape') and turf as individual people harvest from the bog.


Visually the difference is :




and even there the turf is hopper turf (the hopper being the machine that squeezes the turf into long brown sausages, cf. the tune 'The Cat in the Hopper'), cutting by hand has nearly died out.

[MTGuru]

MT got it right with the Bord na Mona reference but failed when making the distinction between Bord na Mona briquettes (as advertised), made from industrially harvested peat ( 'Bord na Mona, turning the Midlands into a brown desert/moonscape') and turf as individual people harvest from the bog.

No no, Gumby, I didn't get it wrong. You see, because I am such a manly man, seeing the advert inspired me to go out and cut my own. No girly briquettes for me, no sir! Just as seeing a McDonald's commercial inspires me to slaughter my own beef. Manly men are like that.

The problem is that I drove all over San Diego yesterday looking for a peat bog, without success. And I thought we had everything here in Southern California. I did find a Pete Boggs in the telephone directory, but he was completely uncooperative.

As for turning lovely landscapes into moonscapes, no worries here. Because large parts of San Diego already look like moonscapes.

[Steve Bliven]

New T-shirt message: "Manly men play whistles"

Best wishes.

Steve

[cboody]

MT is spot on of course, but I'd still suggest playing an E in place of the folded C. To me that sounds much better than folding the C and having that jump.

[benhall.1]

MT is spot on of course, but I'd still suggest playing an E in place of the folded C. To me that sounds much better than folding the C and having that jump.

OK, well since we've come down to voting about it may I say that I am, firmly, in the MT, 'fold it up' camp here? It sounds more idiomatic, generally better and, once you get it right, even your listeners will be fooled, often, into thinking you're playing the lower C instead. Even though they know you can't be. This happens especially in sessions, but it's such standard practice that I reckon in any context it's just better.

There. No sitting on the fence for me!*




*not tonight anyway - I seem to have done me back in, as they say ...

[whistle1000]

I agree with you and MT...learning how to control the folding of a tune is essential to any good whistle player...IMHO...not a fan of the harmonizing so much....one example of a tune that takes a lot of folding is Loftus Jones....I can't ever imagine how this could be played using harmonies instead....there are lots of tunes that require this skill...it's a good skill to have...practice and have fun with it...try learning Loftus Jones....you'll see what we are talking about..

[cboody]

I don't think I'm necessarily "on the other side" from MT, but rather that I like the E better in this situation. Folding is indeed an important skill and should be developed. And, If you are playing this in a group staying with the C makes good sense since it avoids a sudden and districting single note of harmony. I was, however, thinking of playing alone. Didn't make that very clear though did I?

[bigsciota]

I'll put myself down in the play an E category. I'll fold if I know I'll be playing with someone, and I'll fold if it's a faster tune or if I think it fits. But jumping up an octave just for one note, especially if it's in a slower piece, feels pretty jarring. There are waltzes like Ook Pik and Josephine's that also go down to a C and B, and I just fool around a third above or so to get it to sound coherent.

One thing I will add is if you do fold up, think about folding the line or a few more notes up there. It might sound a bit more fluid if it doesn't sound like you're jumping an octave just for that note. But really, whatever you think sounds best is going to be best.