New Flute Yay!!

NicoMoreno · Post by **NicoMoreno** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 6:33 pm

So, I just got my "new" flute ($86 USD -- ~120$ CAD).

It was billed as a "civil war era flute" with no maker markings, no key markings, nothing. (not even a funny picture ):

The barrel is cracked through (two cracks) and the tuning slide is completely seized. (This of course will be easier to fix, since I can just take the wood of the barrel right off and attack the brass slide)

All the keys need to be repadded, however they also appear to be sealing fine (they are just black and rotting, otherwise I would leave em) The only one I am worried about is the Eb key, since the pad is loose... and gross (more so than the rest:)

There are six keys, and the flute ends at the D. (Eb, F, Long F, Ab, Bb, Cnat)

I do have a few questions: what is the best way to unseize a tuning slide?
What is the best way to repad keys? (I heard/saw something about some sort of foam way??)

And why the heck can't I get a decent low D (any low D) a decent E (too weak) or a decent F# (actually, I can almost get this) when I can get all these notes on other flutes??

Actually don't answer that last one. I suspect it is either the cheapness, or me.

Jack Bradshaw · Post by **Jack Bradshaw** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 6:42 pm

Assuming the slide isn't bent or jammed...take the wood off and soak the slide in a penetrant like "Kroil" or other crud dissolving stuff (auto store) Even WD-40 might do it. Be patient. Don't get penetrating oil on the wood...etc etc

Jack

NicoMoreno · Post by **NicoMoreno** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:06 pm

soak it as in let the whole thing stand in it for a while?

And how long?

Luckily, the slide appears undamaged, merely EXTREMELY tarnished/rusted/ etc...

And green crap everywhere...

Jack Bradshaw · Post by **Jack Bradshaw** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:12 pm

Yes, if possible, at least keep it wet with the stuff. As long as it takes...usually a couple days...depends.

Its not a good oil for the wood though, so if you can remove the wood you are way ahead of the game.

I'm guessing its got post mounts..you may want to see if you can remove the keys...trickier if they are corroded in though...again patience, patience.

NicoMoreno · Post by **NicoMoreno** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:23 pm

well, the barrel is a seperate section, so I don't have to worry about keys for that.

They keys work fairly well, but I can see repadding would be much easier with them off.
They are post mounted, but how do you take them off?

Also, they aren't corroded in place, but definetly could benefit from a cleaning/polishing...

Jack Bradshaw · Post by **Jack Bradshaw** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:35 pm

VERY CAREFULLY

They have pins between the posts. Some are threaded in from one end, older ones I've seen are pressed in pins. One end is flattened and they have to come out that way. Some people have built special little tools to push them out. Probably a good topic to research on the net.

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:38 pm

To remove the keys, look on either side of the posts - you should see a small round dot in the middle which is the pin that runs through the posts and through the key. Try pushing on it with mild force with a small nail or tack, but know that the pin should only move one way - so don't push too hard and try both sides. Hopefully, they will all slide out fairly easily. If not, a small jewelers or tiny hammer (like one of those hammers that come with those tiny screwdriver sets) and gently tap on the nail. Be very careful, that hammer bit is dangerous. You could also try a drop of penetrating oil before going the hammer route.

As for repadding, there are a lot of methods, but I had great luck with the 100% silicone pad method.
1) buy a tube of 100% silicone aquarium sealant.
2) remove keys and clean cups and the key seats.
3) put a big glop of silicone in the cup so it's higher than the cup wall and let it sit for about 20 minutes (until it skins over, be careful, this stuff is sticky and hard to get off your fingers).
4) Oil the key seat.
5) While holding the key in the open position, slide the pin back in and let the keys natural pressure close it.
6) The flute is playable the next day, but I'd let the pad cure before trimming off excess silicone. Trim back slowly so you don't cut too much and cause a leak.

The great thing about silicone is that you don't have to worry about it when oiling, it's cheap and easy (by your third key you'll be a professional), and since the silicone forms to the shape of your key seat, the seats don't have to be perfect.

Good luck!

Eric

NicoMoreno · Post by **NicoMoreno** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 8:02 pm

are there other approved silicone sealants? (I have a bottle or two of different things, like bathroom sealants, etc. Actually, they are my dad's... )

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:43 pm

I've always heard it has to be 100% silicone, and aquarium sealant is just that - it's also really cheap, found in most pet stores, and often in hardware stores. I guess it could be any 100% silicone caulk...

Eric

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:27 am

Eric, that's brilliant! And I just happen to have a leaky D# key and a big ol' tube of aquarium sealant right here in THE SAME HOUSE .....

Nico, I'd wager you can't get those notes because your flute is leaking. The cracks are obviously a big one, but those pads need to return to whatever part of history it was they came out of. Just because they're on doesn't mean they're even close to seating.

If it was me, I'd follow Jack & Eric's instructions; then, if it still leaks, start looking at the joints & tuning cork. Teflon tape is a good fix for the joints (although I remove it after I play -- maybe too cautious on my part, but I'd hate to have a cracked tenon from expansion & binding); removing the cap and tuning cork and greasing the cork (SEE CURRENT THREAD ABOUT FLUTE OILING & CORK REMOVAL!) might give you some help there, too.

Good luck!

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:44 am

Cathy - while I'd like to accept the praise for this technique, I nabbed it from a couple of folks on this board (but for the life of me, I can't recall who now...

) and some folks over at The Session.

Even if it's not my idea...it is simply brilliant!

You can also use the stuff to replace the touches on the back of your keys so they don't clack when they hit the wood, AND, it even repairs aquariums, cracked bird baths - heck, it's the duck tape of sealants.

Eric

NicoMoreno · Post by **NicoMoreno** » Sat Jun 26, 2004 10:26 am

What's the best way to remove the pads and clean the cups and key seats?

Thanks!

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Sat Jun 26, 2004 12:26 pm

Heat the key back with a candle - they're likely shellaced in and this will get them out.

Eric

NicoMoreno · Post by **NicoMoreno** » Sat Jun 26, 2004 2:57 pm

Thanks everybody!
I have been working on it for a while...

I have the tuning slide in a film case (empty:), with the headjoint out of all oil. The flute is completely disassembled (COMPLETELY). All the metal (including rings, but not including posts) is off and shined courtesy of Brasso. I have one key being padded (100% silicone bath and kitchen sealant).

I used a soldering iron to remove the pads. I was going to use a match to test it out, when my borther suggested a soldering iron. It works, and there is no carbon build up. Just make sure the solder has all been cleaned off!

So my last questions are: what's the best way to fix cracks? How should I go about it?

I have been given the suggestions of very thin white glue and wax... Where would I find them, and what exactly am I looking for?

Thanks!

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:20 pm

My teacher recently told me that several layers of Super-Glue (clean up messes & around edges with fine, fine, fine steel wool) are good; on the final layer you mix it with ebony dust and kind of paint it in there.

However, I don't know how this works for cracks that go all the way thru the bore .....

Is it worth taking it to your local music shop and talking to the oboe/clarinet/bassoon repairer -- and maybe even letting him or her fix it for you?