Union pipes on the mainland

A forum about Uilleann (Irish) pipes and the surly people who play them.
Bassdrone
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Tell us something.: Piper from Dublin, Ireland. GHB/SSP and UP. Member of NPU. Would like to join forum to stay in touch with the UP community in general. Also looking for ideas for studio setup/recording and sessions/tionols. Cheers. T

Re: Union pipes on the mainland

Post by Bassdrone »

Lost me at "Mainland"...

In Ireland, the only use of the term I have ever heard is in places like the Islands off our coast where the inhabitants reference the Mainland in the context of getting to Galway, Donegal, Cork or Kerry to go shopping or to go to college/school. Any other use of the term in Ireland (in reference to Britain for example) is likely to raise a few hackles.
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daveboling
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Re: Union pipes on the mainland

Post by daveboling »

Steampacket wrote:Perhaps of interest there are three sets of "union" pipes up for auction in the coming G&H music instruments auction
Do you have a URL for their site?

dave boling
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Mr.Gumby
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Re: Union pipes on the mainland

Post by Mr.Gumby »

Do you have a URL for their site?
That auction was months ago and the instruments were discussed at some length at the time, here
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pancelticpiper
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Re: Union pipes on the mainland

Post by pancelticpiper »

myles wrote: I think the 'Grand Union Pipes' as Kenna called them - multiple regulators and a nearly-chromatic chanter - were a purely Irish development.
There are far more surviving Union pipes of British make than Irish make, including sets with multiple regulators and keyed chanters, from the 18th century and first decades of the 19th century. This appears to be simply due to the fact that there were many more makers in Britain than in Ireland.

Check out Bagpipes by Hugh Cheape where he reviews the surviving instruments, the historic makers, the historic players.

The identification of the Union pipe with Ireland appears to have happened simply because the instrument died out in Britain but survived (just barely) in Ireland. These sorts of accidents of history have happened many times in many places, for example the old Gaelic manner of dress went extinct in Ireland but survived (and evolved almost beyond recognition) in Scotland.
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myles
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Re: Union pipes on the mainland

Post by myles »

There are 2 reg sets and 1 reg sets from Scottish and Northern English makers, but not the fully developed instrument. This first appears in Ireland as far as we know.
The identification of the Union pipe with Ireland appears to have happened simply because the instrument died out in Britain but survived (just barely) in Ireland
This overlooks the fact that small, bellows-blown pipes were being identified specifically as "Irish pipes" by the 1760s and perhaps earlier, before the last Scottish examples. They may have been played and made elsewhere, but they were already associated with Ireland, and the later Union pipes were presented as a development of the Irish instrument - Nicholas Carolan's essay on Denis Courtney gives lots of evidence.
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