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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:44 am 
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Last edited by pancelticpiper on Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:06 am 
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pancelticpiper wrote:
The general trend of this thread goes to show the value of in-person face-to-face (not Skype) lessons.

...


Dealing with it at first hand, I couldn't agree more.

It's also the problem of trying to pick up an instrument that even people in music stores haven't heard of


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:56 am 
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If you can return it easily I would and try another Bb. But if you mail ordered it and return postage makes it uneconomical I would try the tape experiment. Your issue could be related to not quite closing the holes. It takes a bit of practice to get that right. Sometimes we can successfully get notes out of a high D with our fingertips, but the lower whistles will need you to use more of the pads of your fingers, search "Pipers grip" you will likely find a thread on this site. Good luck to you.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 1:13 pm 
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ddp,

Going a little further . . .

Whistles can vary *widely* in their "voices".

Most notably, some whistle have a great deal of "wind" in their voices, the "wind" being a "rushing-of-air" sound. At the other extreme are voices, like recorders, that are crystal clear, with no wind.

If you're not used to hearing the wind, it might mask/obscure the note being played. This is especially true of a whistle's lowest notes because they are the softest (i.e. lowest volume). I know my A is that way.

So, with your taped Bb, I'd like to offer 2 suggestions:

1) Try using a "tuner" to check the pitch of your taped Bb note. Here's an online tuner:

https://www.flutetunes.com/tuner/.

I just tried it out. Seems to work fine. Just turn on your computer's microphone, start blowing, and the tuner will measure the pitch being played.

2) Try a test. If you're getting a proper note (instead of a screech/squawk), you should be able "bend" the note a little up + down by varying your breath. Blow a little harder, the pitch will go up a bit. Blow a little softer, the pitch will go down.

It really is too bad you don't have an experienced player nearby. We're trying to help by remote-control . . .

I confess, my curiosity is really up about this. Please report back if you get a chance.

trill

ps: I'd like to 2nd busterbill's suggestion. If you can exchange it easily (from your local music store), you could simply try another Bb unit.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:51 am 
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busterbill wrote:
If you can return it easily I would and try another Bb. But if you mail ordered it and return postage makes it uneconomical I would try the tape experiment. Your issue could be related to not quite closing the holes. It takes a bit of practice to get that right. Sometimes we can successfully get notes out of a high D with our fingertips, but the lower whistles will need you to use more of the pads of your fingers, search "Pipers grip" you will likely find a thread on this site. Good luck to you.


For hygiene reasons they do not accept wind instruments back . I cannot try another Bb as they don't stock them. They ordered that particular one from the main store in the capital. They didn't even know that whistles come in almost any key. They only have Sweetones D and C which btw have their mouthpieces wrapped in plastic (Gen don't).
I know about the pipers grip. I 'm not worrying about it yet as I can reach the holes just fine. I might experiment with it later though since it looks more comfortable for the fingers. Thank you.

trill wrote:
...


I hadn't noticed the wind till you mentioned it. I don't mind it at all.

Trill, I have to confess that I feel stupid now.
I knew about the tuners that they use for the string instruments, but I had absolutely no idea that there are similar tools for wind ones, let alone software solutions that can work with a plain computer microphone. No book, no article, no video has ever mentioned them! They are amazing and absolutely helpful. I cannot thank you enough for that piece of info.
I checked the local shop and they have one for the price of a Bb whistle. I might get one in order to not be stuck in front of the computer
(It's this one https://www.staggmusic.com/en/products/view/CTUC9 in case someone has experience with it)

On to the interesting part:
I used the online tuner and I ve also found another one at https://www.alexdemartos.es/wtuner/ with the same results.
A is at 440HZ for all whistles, right?
I 've found that I have been playing the B and A with my Sweetone D as flats. I guess it has to do with my preference for lower sounds. All the rest within the acceptable ranges, but the lower the note the more I 'm closer to the perfect spot.

The Bb one:
I ' m not messing with the second octave yet. It indeed has a gray area between the two octaves and I guess that is how the conical whistles make the second one easier. They eliminate or almost eliminate that area making the transition instant. It may be something more as well, but this is my impression so far.
Keeping an eye on the tuner I stayed below that area and the cacophony which was troubling me around the middle holes disappeared. The top couple of holes didn't seem to suffer from that. So it was mainly a breath problem after all. I was clearly not blowing into the second oct or I would have realized it but not staying in the first one either. I guess I have to learn how to jump that gap.

...And finally that mysterious Bb note.
I taped the 4 top holes, keeping the bottom 2, one for each index finger. D? Fine. C? Just fine too. Bb? Pretty much spot on!
Then why does it feel so wrong?
I 've tried to record myself, but I can hear nothing wrong when playing it back. (The mic maybe cannot pick it up?) But it s always there when playing.
I m thinking that being in front of the instrument and behind and in physical contact with it may be altering the perception of the same sound.
The first notes all sound equally smooth and stable, but that Bb has some graze into it. The air in the tube vibrates so violently that sometimes I can feel that vibrating air with my finger covering the big C hole. That Bb is like coming from a different instrument, maybe a reed one to exaggerate a bit.
Is the difference from C to Bb that great that causes so many changes?
If I had an A below that I would be able to tell if that Bb is the turning point to notes with a different character (at least in the way that I perceive them).
I can't be the only one so sensitive to it and I know that I 'm not getting crazy because I don't hear voices as well. Yet. :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:41 am 
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ddp wrote:
I checked the local shop and they have one for the price of a Bb whistle. I might get one in order to not be stuck in front of the computer
(It's this one https://www.staggmusic.com/en/products/view/CTUC9 in case someone has experience with it)
That tuner relies on picking up vibrations from the surface it's clipped to, not from the air. It might work for a trumpet blowing at a music stand. I don't think it would work reliably with a whistle. Something like https://www.staggmusic.com/en/products/view/TUCSL would be more suitable.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:44 am 
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There are plenty of tuner apps for mobile phones, free ones too. They do the job.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:04 am 
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Tunborough wrote:
ddp wrote:
I checked the local shop and they have one for the price of a Bb whistle. I might get one in order to not be stuck in front of the computer
(It's this one https://www.staggmusic.com/en/products/view/CTUC9 in case someone has experience with it)
That tuner relies on picking up vibrations from the surface it's clipped to, not from the air. It might work for a trumpet blowing at a music stand. I don't think it would work reliably with a whistle. Something like https://www.staggmusic.com/en/products/view/TUCSL would be more suitable.


Hmm, I don't know. It says that it has a mic as well. From the 29 tuners that they carry it s the only one that they propose for wind instruments. I ll drop by the shop and ask when I get the chance. I guess a tuner for flutes will work perfectly with whistles, right?

Mr.Gumby wrote:

There are plenty of tuner apps for mobile phones, free ones too. They do the job.

I guess I 'll try them, if you say that they are accurate enough.
Thanks

Would it be ridiculous to stick a standalone tuner onto the whistle?


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:14 pm 
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I 've got some interesting news.
Keeping an eye on the tuner for consistency I 've found out that this graze in the Bb note that I don't like goes away if I play it really softly as almost an A


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:29 pm 
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Quote:
Would it be ridiculous to stick a standalone tuner onto the whistle?


Just tried it with one of my ukulele chromatic clip on tuners........& it works perfectly. :D

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:13 am 
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Don't feel bad. I got my brass Gen Bb a couple of weeks ago from a supplier here in the US and it's nothing to write home about. And the upper half of the second octave is very unsteady as the amount of air pressure it takes to achieve the clearest note it is able to achieve tends to vary for some reason. And that is clearEST, not necessarily clear.

My advice? If you want to stick with the Generation, just go online and order a new one, the one you want, from somewhere and take the chance you'll get a better one. That is if having one mailed to you is not twice as much as the whistle is worth.

The overall impression I'm left with from my recent lay research has indicated to me that current production Gen Bb's tend to be better overall than their high D counterparts, so the odds of getting a bettER one are in your favor.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:14 am 
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I have bought, given away, and kept a number of Generation Bb whistles during the past two years. My impression is that the nickel ones are more consistent than the brass. Although some of them played better than others, all were serviceable instruments. I recently bought a nickel one from Amazon for $13.00 free shipping. Not bad.


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