Decent keyless flute in D - Hamilton or Cotter?

[kildarekonga]

Hi

I've been playing an unknown flute (should we have a 'name that flute' thread for unusual imports?) for about 25 years and have decided recently to get serious about it (or have more fun with it - depending on your perspective).

I put an Olwell 6 key on order about 3 years ago .. this was for my 50th .. and now I'm about half way there.

In the meantime I've been mulling over getting a decent keyless in D. I've been thinking about Hamilton, Doyle, Watson etc etc and I know that in the end it comes down to personal choice.

My question is .. is it true that the Hamilton is harder to fill than say the Cotter? I've had a chat with Eamon and I'm definitely heading in that direction but mostly because I get the feel that it's an easier flute to play than the Hamilton?
Welcome your thoughts.

Thanks

Neil (Kildare, Ireland)

Just to encourage myself and keep a diary of my thoughts on playing/tunes as I try to deserve that Olwell 50th present I started a blog. http://theroadtomassiesmill.blogspot.ie ... 305mm.html
Partly a diary on playing .. practice .. tunes .. my thoughts as I progress. Suppose I just wanted to have something to look back on as the months go by to see how I'm getting on.

[jim stone]

I've owned both, and, setting aside questions of better and worse, for me, anyhow, the Cotter was easier to play, the holes a bit smaller, the Hamilton
somewhat more of a 'handful.' If that's what matters to you, sounds like you aren't going in the wrong direction, anyhow.

[accordionstu]

I have tried and owned a few D Flutes over past few years some modern and some considered the holy grail, in my opinion the best D Flute for intonation, quality build, easy to play, lovely tone and price is the Tony Millyard flutes. Not very well known compared to Hamilton and Olwell, but once you play one you will understand why.

[kildarekonga]

I have tried and owned a few D Flutes over past few years some modern and some considered the holy grail, in my opinion the best D Flute for intonation, quality build, easy to play, lovely tone and price is the Tony Millyard flutes. Not very well known compared to Hamilton and Olwell, but once you play one you will understand why.

Had a look at the website and certainly he's very reasonable priced. Having a look at a few of his videos. I imagine the challenge of the, as you say, not very well known, makers is getting that buzz going so you see a lot of players and reviews shouting about how good they are. For me the challenge would be hearing someone in Ireland playing it to see if it suits. Sounds good on the online videos tho!

[kkrell]

I'm curious if you've picked a model of a Olwell yet for your keyed order, or if you are waiting until you get closer on the list? Why not order a keyless Olwell in the meantime, with a shorter waitlist, and usually can be credited against your keyed order. Anyway, you might want to pick a keyless that is a similar player. The Hamilton is a Pratten-style flute, and can certainly blast through in a session. Large holes, and while an initial challenge to get comfortable with it, is definitely a satisfying beast. Orlaith McAuliffe plays a Hamilton ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6laGmJPdLU ). The low D takes some practice to bring up to pitch and honk. I haven't played a Cotter, but it should also be Pratten-like. Martin Doyle's flutes are very expressive tonally, and might remind you more of a Rudall-style quality. Brian Finnegan of Flook & KAN often plays a Doyle flute ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JUrg7qG0Ak ).

[jim stone]

Here's a Cotter:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGyJIf3xz0Y

[kildarekonga]

I'm curious if you've picked a model of a Olwell yet for your keyed order, or if you are waiting until you get closer on the list? Why not order a keyless Olwell in the meantime, with a shorter waitlist, and usually can be credited against your keyed order. Anyway, you might want to pick a keyless that is a similar player. The Hamilton is a Pratten-style flute, and can certainly blast through in a session. Large holes, and while an initial challenge to get comfortable with it, is definitely a satisfying beast. Orlaith McAuliffe plays a Hamilton ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6laGmJPdLU ). The low D takes some practice to bring up to pitch and honk. I haven't played a Cotter, but it should also be Pratten-like. Martin Doyle's flutes are very expressive tonally, and might remind you more of a Rudall-style quality. Brian Finnegan of Flook & KAN often plays a Doyle flute ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JUrg7qG0Ak ).

I'm talking to Aaron a Six Key Blackwood pratten with Sterling silver keys and rings with silver tube in headjoint.
Last time I checked he was I think a year for the keyless but good point - I'll check in with him to be sure.

The loudness of the Hamilton is certainly attractive but the large holes - well maybe I need to get my hands on one to try to see how hard it is to fill it. The unknown flute I've been using for 25 years may be easy or hard to fill .. I've nothing to compare it against .. so I don't know if I'll struggle or not.

But .. great to have such great makers to choose from .. this is a good problem if you know what I mean.

[kildarekonga]

Here's a Cotter:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGyJIf3xz0Y

These are all great videos/flutes. I read a great interview with Eamonn and had a nice chat with him so I think that pushed me towards that flute. That said I can see the pros and cons of others (including the less known flute makers). I've written to Aaron so will see on their wait time .. might make sense as I'm getting an Olwell 6 key to play a similar keyless .. but I don't want to wait a year. If the Olwell keyless is too long then the next step is to get my hands on some of the mentioned flutes .. see what suits. But as I mentioned - these are excellent problems to have.

[wolftune]

I have not played a Hamilton, but owned 2 Cotters (sold the D keyless, kept the e-flat) and own a keyless Olwell. I also have a Sam Murray and an old Keith Prowse flute.

I find the Olwell by far the easiest of the bunch to play. I went from a crappy no-name to a Cotter within the first year of playing, played the Cotter for a year, and then graduated to the Olwell. While I really like the Olwell, I did find that playing other flutes was challenging when I would try them. Maybe it's just me, but I think the ease of playing the Olwell might have made my embouchure a tad lazy.

I recently bought an older, quirky Sam Murray, Boxwood, Rudall-style flute. At first, I could barely make it go in the way I wanted. After working at it for about 4 months, I was loving the tone and nuance to that flute. I then went back to my Cotter and it sounded lovely, much better than I remembered. Went to the Olwell, and it had even more power and rich tone, although I kind of preferred the more nuanced tone color of the Cotter. The Cotter also has plenty of oomph and power when you lay into it.

I recently sold my Cotter only because I have too many flutes and have ordered a 6-key Lesouef. I miss the Cotter. He's also a lovely guy in my experience.

One last thing, I contacted Mr. Cotter 6 months ago about making a Rudall-style flute and he said he's experimenting with the idea. That might be an option, as then you'd have one of each style of flute.

[chas]

I had a Hammy that I loved, but it took a toll on my hands (I have hereditary arthritis, primarily in the RH index finger, but also in both thumbs). The stretch on the Hammy is a bit more than a large-holed Olwell, but that E hole on both is hard for me to cover. As to haw difficult any flute is to fill, that's really a function of your own anatomy and training. I often hear the expression "X flute has a great low D," or "X flute has a great upper octave," when that's the opposite of my experience.

All of those mentioned make quality flutes. As others, I find Olwell's flutes just so easy to play and easy to get a variety of volumes and timbres from. I'm expecting a fully keyed Nicholson any month now (really).

[Uni Flute]

A friend of mine owns an Eamonn Cotter 6 key blackwood flute and I must say each time I've had the opportunity to play it, I've been seriously impressed by how easy it is to fill, the warm tone and sheer playability of this instrument. It's also perhaps the lightest keyed modern flute I've ever encountered.

[kildarekonga]

I received a few emails with people selling flutes etc. Thanks for contacting me.
Just to let you know that I bought a second hand D blackwood Olwell with a Eb body/foot yesterday.

Posted a (more than slightly) dramatised version of yesterday's purchase here http://theroadtomassiesmill.blogspot.ie ... flute.html