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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 10:12 pm 
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benhall.1 wrote:
MadmanWithaWhistle wrote:
I will never, ever make my Feadog sound good, because even with a carefully sanded windway, smooth fipple and puttied back, it will never be a good whistle. I often give it to my whistler friends as a joke, because as they struggle to play it it's clear that no amount of tweaking will render it playable.


Or, that that amount of tweaking has rendered it unplayable.

Precisely.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 10:13 pm 
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FascinatedWanderer wrote:
My first ever whistle was a 6 euro one I bought in a random tourist trap sort of place in Ireland. I thought it was pretty lousy then. I've been playing for two years now, and I realize it's actually very lousy. I don't accept that '99%' of random, cheap off the shelf whistles are playable quality.


From long, long ago...

Peter Laban wrote:
There are some really sweet ones but as I said before: it's a thing of nuances: if you can't play a regular one half decent you won't be able to recognise the nice ones anyway. After this discussion came up the last time (about a month ago) I was in Custy's with my twelve year old. He wanted a new one so for the hell of it I blew ten or twelve random Generations. They weren't all the same but all were perfectly serviceable whistles that would work fine as they were. We bought an Oak eventually because of the stronger fundamental in the low octave which gives it a nice sound. For the rest of it, yes it's a load of hot air, misinformation and misconceptions.

FWIW, Jerry Freeman told me last week he still had a clip of me playing an unteaked one he sent me for comparison, one he thought one of the unplayable ones. He thought it sounded just lovely.
I have also mentioned Brid O Donohue's C a few times. Nice whistle but none of you would recognise it as a special one. But can she make it talk.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:37 am 
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Nomi wrote:
I play a sweetone that I painted black with fingernail polish almost exclusively.

I'm curious if you painted over Whistling Billy. Of course y'know that you can get a Sweetone in black. I wonder if anyone else has customised their whistle. Occasionally I paint the holes with a drop of black paint...

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 1:02 am 
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hoopy mike wrote:
Nomi wrote:
I play a sweetone that I painted black with fingernail polish almost exclusively.

I wonder if anyone else has customised their whistle.

I am tempted occasionally by the idea of anodising my aluminium whistles in some fancy colour, like a bright metallic blue or yellow, or maybe just a matt grey, but life's too short.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 3:05 am 
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hoopy mike wrote:
From long, long ago...

Peter Laban wrote:
FWIW, Jerry Freeman told me last week he still had a clip of me playing an untweaked one he sent me for comparison, one he thought one of the unplayable ones. He thought it sounded just lovely.


Quoting someone else quoting me is not quite kosher.

Yes, Peter can make a stock Generation others would struggle with sound lovely. However, Peter has been playing for decades. I have observed that the advanced players tend to come around and tell the new people "It's the player, not the whistle ... ." I don't feel this is altogether fair to a new player.

In my experience, it isn't necessary for a new player to have to struggle with the whistle, wonder whether it's them or the whistle causing the difficulty. People come to me at events or send email saying they had purchased a whistle years ago, tried to play it, became frustrated and put it down. They say if they'd had one of my whistles then, they wouldn't have given up. MANY of the top whistle instructors in my region recommend my whistles for beginners, ask me to attend teaching events without charging a vendor's fee, etc. so my whistles will be available to serious whistle students. And based on the fact that at last count, at least seven All-Ireland champions play my whistles (not exclusively, of course), please don't try to say my whistles have been compromised in some way so beginners can handle them.

I had intended to stay out of this discussion, but having been cited by someone else, I felt I had to respond. If I have offended anyone, I apologize.

Best wishes,
Jerry

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:03 am 
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Jerry Freeman wrote:
Quoting someone else quoting me is not quite kosher.

Ok - apologies if I've offended you with the second-hand quote. Oops - now I'm quoting you quoting me quoting Peter quoting you!

The reason for sharing the story was to illustrate that a whistle regarded by Jerry (who is rightly well-respected in the whistling community) as "unplayable" (and ok, that's Peter's side of the story, not from the mouse's mouth) could sound playable in the hands and mouth of someone else. That was in no way meant to imply anything negative about Jerry's whistling or whistles or about his mouse.

My personal experience is that I found a whistle described by Peter as "unplayable" to be playable in my hands, although this in no way implies that I'm anywhere as good a whistler as Peter is. Perhaps "playable" to me is just a cover for my lack of refined taste when it comes to whistle acoustics.

I've not been playing whistle for decades, and I'm acutely aware of my limitations, but I've found that when I'm presented with a whistle described as "unplayable" or "difficult" or generally "not very good" or "cheap" where "cheap" is used as a shorthand for "poor quality" by a beginner, or sometimes even by someone with more experience, then on every occasion I've found it playable. Maybe not great in some cases, but certainly playable. Another example is a Susato that Dr. Phil passed on to me, but that's another story.

If every beginner and teacher finds that Jerry's whistles take away any potential for the excuse that "it might be the whistle that's the problem" then that's great. I have no personal experience with these whistles, but I've never seen a bad review for one, so they seem like a good bet. But what I'm wary of is when other people (not Jerry) suggest that a Freeman whistle is an instant solution to problems caused by inexperience and poor technique.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:52 am 
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Jerry Freeman wrote:
I had intended to stay out of this discussion, but having been cited by someone else...

I cited your mouse ...and implied some unnatural relationship with a parrot. So I guess I should apologize to the parrot. Sorry.
:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:04 am 
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Jerry Freeman wrote:
In my experience, it isn't necessary for a new player to have to struggle with the whistle, wonder whether it's them or the whistle causing the difficulty.

Uh-oh - common sense. Someone call a moderator.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:08 am 
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JTC111 wrote:
They squeaked and squawked like the demon offspring of a parrot and that horny mouse running around Jerry Freeman's house.


You can say what you like about my mouse and my mouse's friends, but don't bring the children into this!

Best wishes,
Jerry

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You can purchase my whistles:
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directly from me (send a PM),
from one of the vendors who carry Freeman whistles.


Last edited by Jerry Freeman on Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:16 am 
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Jerry Freeman wrote:
please don't try to say my whistles have been compromised in some way so beginners can handle them.

To be fair, Jerry, I don't think Mike even suggested that.

hoopy mike wrote:
I have no personal experience with these whistles

But I do (and like the ones I've got)...

Quote:
But what I'm wary of is when other people (not Jerry) suggest that a Freeman whistle is an instant solution to problems caused by inexperience and poor technique.

And also completely agree with that.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:20 am 
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Peter Duggan wrote:
Jerry Freeman wrote:
please don't try to say my whistles have been compromised in some way so beginners can handle them.

To be fair, Jerry, I don't think Mike even suggested that.

I've heard that they even have the holes pre-drilled!

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:58 am 
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I've been playing Gens for 30 years, but not seriously playing. I began playing whistle seriously 12 years ago, however.
I'm not good by the standards I aspire to meet, but I'm not incompetent.

The Gens have gotten
worse through this period, quality control slipped. I go into a local, friendly music store and play
all the gens, occasionally. Occasionally one is good, many are barely playable and just as many
are unplayable--though probably somebody very good could play them somehow.

I think we do
noobies a disservice when we tell them its the player, not the whistle in circumstances
like these, where there is a real possibility that only an expert could play the whistle.

Jerrry's whistles are surely the way out of this conundrum. The noobie has something that plays.
We can say with confidence that the problems, if any, are the player's technique.
With a store bought cheapie, there is a substantial possibility we are mistaken.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFG5fG-y2S0


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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:21 am 
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jim stone wrote:
I think we do
noobies a disservice when we tell them its the player, not the whistle in circumstances
like these, where there is a real possibility that only an expert could play the whistle.

And I think we do them a disservice by telling them a Jerry Freeman whistle will solve everything when we haven't actually seen or heard what they're doing with what they've got.

Quote:
Jerrry's whistles are surely the way out of this conundrum.

They're one way, for sure, but you make it sound like there's only one way when there are many and Jerry's by no means the only maker offering consistently reliable whistles at modest prices.

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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:11 pm 
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Just get a Dixon, or other quality pvc type whistle. No warm up needed, not excessively expensive, and noob (and non-noob) friendly.


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 Post subject: Re: SO disappointed... any tips?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:40 pm 
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hoopy mike wrote:
benhall.1 wrote:
MadmanWithaWhistle wrote:
I will never, ever make my Feadog sound good, because even with a carefully sanded windway, smooth fipple and puttied back, it will never be a good whistle. I often give it to my whistler friends as a joke, because as they struggle to play it it's clear that no amount of tweaking will render it playable.


Or, that that amount of tweaking has rendered it unplayable.

Precisely.



Incorrect, as it happens. The whistle was marginally improved by the tweaks but still an impressively poor instrument.


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