Wheatstone Flutes

mat · Post by **mat** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 3:22 pm

I have just aquired a nice 8keyed flute by W.Wheatstone, pesumably in cocus (although the grain looks very much like rosewood).

Having trawled through several books on flutes I have come up with few references to William Wheatstone or his flutes. Exhaustive searching of the internet has so far yielded a reference to Jack Coen playing one, but that is it.

Anyone out there got any info?

Anyone else out there got a Wheatstone (not a concertina!)?

bradhurley · Post by **bradhurley** » Wed Sep 10, 2003 7:08 pm

Jack Coen does (or did) indeed play a Wheatstone flute, not in the greatest of condition when I saw it a few years ago. It's the only Wheatstone flute I've ever seen.

I think their reputation for concertinas deservedly overshawdowed their reputation for flutes. Not that the flute Jack was playing was bad, just not particularly stellar. He was considering switching to an old German flute.

andrew · Post by **andrew** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:27 am

William Wheatstone , born Gloucester 17th August 1775 ;d. London 1854 .
Father of Charles, the inventor of the concertina ,and his brother William ( 2 ). Listed as player , teacher , flutemaker ,inventer of the famous patent flute mouthpiece .Joined the business established by his sons around 1830
What pitch does the flute play at ?

mat · Post by **mat** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 10:40 am

Thanks for the info. guys.

With the tuning slide right in the pitch is too high for my rather limited tuner to cope with. It plays at 440 with the slide out about 5/8 of an inch; if that helps. The embouchue and tone holes are quite small (for an 8key).

I have taken a few pictures of it but hve no idea how to put them on the forum. I will work on that[/img]

kevin m. · Post by **kevin m.** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 11:35 am

bradhurley wrote:Jack Coen does (or did) indeed play a Wheatstone flute, not in the greatest of condition when I saw it a few years ago. It's the only Wheatstone flute I've ever seen.

I think their reputation for concertinas deservedly overshawdowed their reputation for flutes. Not that the flute Jack was playing was bad, just not particularly stellar. He was considering switching to an old German flute.

I recently purchased the album 'Traditional Irish music on Flute and Guitar' by Jack and Jimmy Coen,via Custy's.On the sleeve photos,Jack is shown playing a Blackwood keyed flute which has two HOSE CLIPS

on the headpiece,either side of the Emb. hole!
Is this his Wheatstone?
The album is dated 2001.
Incidentally,I really like Jack's playing,though I don't think that this album is in the same league as cracking 'The Branchline' album that Jack recorded with brother Charlie in the 70's.

bradhurley · Post by **bradhurley** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 12:36 pm

Yep, the hoseclamp flute would be his Wheatstone!

Jack's well into his 70s now, so his playing is certainly not what it once was. But last time I saw him (two or three years ago) he was still getting a powerful sound out of his flute, with a rock-solid rhythm, and his memory for old settings of tunes was remarkable.

Jack had a big influence on me, even though I only spent a week learning from him. When I met him I had been playing for 10-12 years in a heavily Matt Molloy-influenced style of playing, very fluid and full of ornamentation. My playing became much simpler and more melodic after spending a week with Jack Coen. He taught me the value of leaving things out, and of focusing on melody rather than ornamentation.

mat · Post by **mat** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 2:38 pm

[quote="andrew"],inventer of the famous patent flute mouthpiece .quote]

Forgot to mention there are two 'woodworm size' holes beneath the embouchure on my W.Wheatstone. Perhaps for said mouthpiece?

Have often heard of them but never seen one. How do they attach?

andrew · Post by **andrew** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:58 pm

Something , perhaps,like the attachment shown by Kevin M with his newly arrived Haynes flute , I seem to remember from a long time back seeing such things .I must search the catalogues .

kevin m. · Post by **kevin m.** » Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:16 pm

Would you believe I've never even looked at that gizmo since I received it last saturday-in fact its still wrapped up in a roll of bubblewrap!
I must have a look at it tomorrow.
I was interested to read that these 'trainers' were used by newby fifers during the American civil war,as this sort of ties in a little with the possible age of the Haynes flute- 1862 onwards (probably quite a bit onwards!).
I wonder if the flute and training gizmo are contemporary?

mat · Post by **mat** » Fri Sep 12, 2003 3:51 pm

So, can anyone find a picture of the Wheatstone Patent Mouthpiece? I have searched the web but can only find the occasional mention. I was at the Horniman Museum the other week, I bet they have one. Bit far to travel tho'.

Anyone in Britain, its well worth a visit. How many flutes can you fit in one room! Oh and guitar things made from armadillos.

kevin m. · Post by **kevin m.** » Fri Sep 12, 2003 3:56 pm

I looked at that mouthpiece today-it's quite robustly built (cast metal windway).the thing is hinged to fit onto the flute,unfortunately it's missing the screw which holds it in place.
I couldn't see any name or makers symbol on it.

mat · Post by **mat** » Fri Sep 12, 2003 4:04 pm

does it have two studs or similar to hold it in place below the embouchure?

andrew · Post by **andrew** » Fri Sep 12, 2003 5:13 pm

I am searching for an illustration of a Wheatstone patent attachment I have somewhere .Can anybody tell me how to put the picture on the site ?

Gordon · Post by **Gordon** » Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:20 pm

bradhurley wrote:Jack Coen does (or did) indeed play a Wheatstone flute, not in the greatest of condition when I saw it a few years ago. It's the only Wheatstone flute I've ever seen.

I think their reputation for concertinas deservedly overshawdowed their reputation for flutes. Not that the flute Jack was playing was bad, just not particularly stellar. He was considering switching to an old German flute.

Last I saw Jack, he still uses that flute; every time he thinks about changing flutes, he eventually comes back to that battered, barely-held- together plumber's dream of a flute. He told me that it suits his "pointy little fingers". I think the German flute you mention is the one he sold me a few years ago. He told me at the time that he was considering using it as his main flute, but it didn't take. Much heavier, and too many keys he'd never use, I think.
I agree with you that the Wheatstone is not a particularly great-sounding flute, but it certainly works for him; this is the same flute he used on all his recordings, to my knowledge. He has a very unique grip and embouchure, and he's pretty comfortable with this flute.
Gordon

mat · Post by **mat** » Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:57 am

Can I take it then that Jacks flute, like mine, has pretty small tone holes?

I am slowly getting her back into playing condition after many years gathering dust in a cupboard. She will never be a 'tune cannon' but plays very sweetly and easily.