Questions Regarding Foot Keys

[Sirchronique]

So, I’ve long had the intention of having new body segments made for my flute to add keywork to it. I had a 5-key flute briefly in the past, but sold it and have been playing keyless since 2016 or so. Until now, I have been finding ways to manage the sharps and flats with a combination of cross-fingering, half-holing, and other work-arounds, and I’m glad I have done so, but there are some notes that are still inaccessible or inconvenient to me. I’m also progressively branching out more and more often into a lot more non-traditional pieces of music on the flute, my own compositions on other instruments, or music from other traditions, and the amount of music I play that would benefit from having a few keys is increasing to the extent that I want to make my instrument more friendly for those other musical contexts.

I’d ideally like to give myself a possible chromatic range from low C and up, but with the minimum amount of keys necessary. As I’ve mainly been a keyless player, I have some questions. I mainly have questions about the low C/C# keys, because that is what I have little experience with. I made a post back when I first got this flute, asking different questions to decide whether to get Böhm or simple-system style keys for the foot, but now it is roughly 6 years later and I’m just now getting around to actually doing it. Adding keys would require me to part with this flute for awhile, so I’ve been procrastinating.


First question- Does adding a low C and C# key affect the strength of the low D? I recall reading this somewhere online, but I have never been able to compare the same flute with a C foot and a keyless foot side-by-side. I realize this may vary from flute to flute, but I am just curious to hear what people think or have experienced with this, generally speaking. My flute is a Lesouef, and I am wanting to add the Böhm style foot keys which her website lists as an option. Should I expect the low C foot to weaken the low D by much, if at all? Does it even noticeably weaken it, or is that a myth?

Second question- I would like to know how the keyed low C foot may be able to affect my cross-fingerings for other notes. Would the keyed C foot have any impact on the way my other cross-fingerings behave? I don’t want to do anything that alters how my Bb or G# notes cross-finger, as I like how those notes play and sound now. Reading the claim that it weakens the low D made me worry that it may weaken my cross-fingered accidentals, as well. Also, does the C foot allow for any new cross-fingerings of any notes by using the low C# and C keys?

Third question- Can I vent the first hole and play a high C by holding down the foot keys and having all fingers down except L1? Can I cran on the resulting C the same way I do on the adjacent OXX-XXX high D note? I don’t mean the lowest low C, but the one an octave up from it. I have very little knowledge of C foot keys, and I don’t know if this would behave the same way as the vented second octave high D next to it, or if raising the first finger to vent would alter the tuning too much. This is mainly a question of curiosity. I know it isn’t established as a traditional thing to do in Irish music. I mainly just want to know out of interest if you can vent the first hole and have all fingers and the lowest key down to play your usual C natural that you’d play on a whistle or keyless flute in this different way.

My main reason for wanting a low C and C# key is simply to be able to play a low C and a low C#, of course. However, if I am adding something, I want to be aware of all possible musical applications for what I am adding.


My current intention is to have keyed segments made that I can switch out with the bottom two segments on my flute, so my flute can have 4 keys, for Low C, low C#, Eb, and F. A strange choice of key arrangement, I know. However, all of the left hand accidentals are easy enough for me to cross-finger, using the right hand and embouchure to lower the pitch, as I am very accustomed to doing by now. I don’t want to have a whole new left hand segment of my flute made without reason, so I will omit the other keys, unless I change my mind someday in the future.


So, yes, I’m mainly concerned with the effects of the low C foot, any changes it may bring to the strength or cross-fingering of other notes, and the functioning of those notes and the application thereof. If you want to infodump any interesting information about foot keys that may be useful to know, then I would be also interested to hear that, as well.

[tstermitz]

Third question- Can I vent the first hole and play a high C by holding down the foot keys and having all fingers down except L1?

Almost. Specifically, on a typical 8-key (don't know about the Boehm-style foot), you vent L2 to provoke the harmonic of the low-C. Low C# is readily available from your middle-D by playing the C# key, but I believe I do that from the unvented middle D (XXX XXX x)

Eb is essential. I always use long-F, because my L-little finger isn't doing anything anyway! Until the key of Bb, and then you have issues going from the Ab fingerings...

Bb key is also very easy to play as the left thumb isn't doing anything other than supporting your flute. That might seem like a big not-doing-anything, but it doesn't take that long to figure out. Plus, a good flute hold that frees up your left thumb will give you better balance and ergonomics.

[Jayhawk]

First question- Does adding a low C and C# key affect the strength of the low D? I recall reading this somewhere online, but I have never been able to compare the same flute with a C foot and a keyless foot side-by-side. I realize this may vary from flute to flute, but I am just curious to hear what people think or have experienced with this, generally speaking. My flute is a Lesouef, and I am wanting to add the Böhm style foot keys which her website lists as an option. Should I expect the low C foot to weaken the low D by much, if at all? Does it even noticeably weaken it, or is that a myth?

I think this depends on whether or not the low C/C# keys are set up properly. If they're too close, the low D can be weaker. On my Wylde, though, the low D is as good as any flute with a short foot. My 8 key Copley has a honking low D, too. I have had antique keyed flutes that had a lesser low D, though, so YMMV.

Second question- I would like to know how the keyed low C foot may be able to affect my cross-fingerings for other notes. Would the keyed C foot have any impact on the way my other cross-fingerings behave? I don’t want to do anything that alters how my Bb or G# notes cross-finger, as I like how those notes play and sound now. Reading the claim that it weakens the low D made me worry that it may weaken my cross-fingered accidentals, as well. Also, does the C foot allow for any new cross-fingerings of any notes by using the low C# and C keys?

Once you have keys, you'll use less cross-fingering, especially for Bb and G#. I've not found any cross fingers that were lost, though, due to the long foot with low keys. You'll finally be able to play Eb/D#, though, which is priceless.

Third question- Can I vent the first hole and play a high C by holding down the foot keys and having all fingers down except L1? Can I cran on the resulting C the same way I do on the adjacent OXX-XXX high D note? I don’t mean the lowest low C, but the one an octave up from it. I have very little knowledge of C foot keys, and I don’t know if this would behave the same way as the vented second octave high D next to it, or if raising the first finger to vent would alter the tuning too much. This is mainly a question of curiosity. I know it isn’t established as a traditional thing to do in Irish music. I mainly just want to know out of interest if you can vent the first hole and have all fingers and the lowest key down to play your usual C natural that you’d play on a whistle or keyless flute in this different way.

The low C# is great for rolling and craning in both octaves. I find it immensely handy for that alone. I've never tried venting my LH1 to play a note, but now I'm going to have to try!

My main reason for wanting a low C and C# key is simply to be able to play a low C and a low C#, of course. However, if I am adding something, I want to be aware of all possible musical applications for what I am adding.

I love having the low C and C#! I use them more than expected but that's because of their utility in rolls and crans.

Eric

[Sirchronique]

Third question- Can I vent the first hole and play a high C by holding down the foot keys and having all fingers down except L1?

Almost. Specifically, on a typical 8-key (don't know about the Boehm-style foot), you vent L2 to provoke the harmonic of the low-C. Low C# is readily available from your middle-D by playing the C# key, but I believe I do that from the unvented middle D (XXX XXX x)

Eb is essential. I always use long-F, because my L-little finger isn't doing anything anyway! Until the key of Bb, and then you have issues going from the Ab fingerings...

Bb key is also very easy to play as the left thumb isn't doing anything other than supporting your flute. That might seem like a big not-doing-anything, but it doesn't take that long to figure out. Plus, a good flute hold that frees up your left thumb will give you better balance and ergonomics.

Thanks for the info on venting the C natural! Much appreciated.

As for the Bb key, I have chosen to omit getting a Bb key due to the fact that I’ve become very accustomed to cross fingering that note, and I’m satisfied with the sound. I’m not concerned about being able to operate a Bb key.

My reason for omitting it is that I do not need it, it would cost more money, it would be one more part that may need maintenance in the future, and it would also require the entire left hand section of my flute to be replaced with a keyed section, which would be even more time and money. That’s a lot of unnecessary negatives to accept just to play a note I can already play easily and comfortably. If I get a good Bb note now, then I see no reason to add it. Plus, if I change my mind I can always have it added in the future.

[Sirchronique]

First question- Does adding a low C and C# key affect the strength of the low D? I recall reading this somewhere online, but I have never been able to compare the same flute with a C foot and a keyless foot side-by-side. I realize this may vary from flute to flute, but I am just curious to hear what people think or have experienced with this, generally speaking. My flute is a Lesouef, and I am wanting to add the Böhm style foot keys which her website lists as an option. Should I expect the low C foot to weaken the low D by much, if at all? Does it even noticeably weaken it, or is that a myth?

I think this depends on whether or not the low C/C# keys are set up properly. If they're too close, the low D can be weaker. On my Wylde, though, the low D is as good as any flute with a short foot. My 8 key Copley has a honking low D, too. I have had antique keyed flutes that had a lesser low D, though, so YMMV.

Second question- I would like to know how the keyed low C foot may be able to affect my cross-fingerings for other notes. Would the keyed C foot have any impact on the way my other cross-fingerings behave? I don’t want to do anything that alters how my Bb or G# notes cross-finger, as I like how those notes play and sound now. Reading the claim that it weakens the low D made me worry that it may weaken my cross-fingered accidentals, as well. Also, does the C foot allow for any new cross-fingerings of any notes by using the low C# and C keys?

Once you have keys, you'll use less cross-fingering, especially for Bb and G#. I've not found any cross fingers that were lost, though, due to the long foot with low keys. You'll finally be able to play Eb/D#, though, which is priceless.

Third question- Can I vent the first hole and play a high C by holding down the foot keys and having all fingers down except L1? Can I cran on the resulting C the same way I do on the adjacent OXX-XXX high D note? I don’t mean the lowest low C, but the one an octave up from it. I have very little knowledge of C foot keys, and I don’t know if this would behave the same way as the vented second octave high D next to it, or if raising the first finger to vent would alter the tuning too much. This is mainly a question of curiosity. I know it isn’t established as a traditional thing to do in Irish music. I mainly just want to know out of interest if you can vent the first hole and have all fingers and the lowest key down to play your usual C natural that you’d play on a whistle or keyless flute in this different way.

The low C# is great for rolling and craning in both octaves. I find it immensely handy for that alone. I've never tried venting my LH1 to play a note, but now I'm going to have to try!

My main reason for wanting a low C and C# key is simply to be able to play a low C and a low C#, of course. However, if I am adding something, I want to be aware of all possible musical applications for what I am adding.

I love having the low C and C#! I use them more than expected but that's because of their utility in rolls and crans.

Eric

As I mentioned in my precious response, I am not adding a Bb, G#, or left hand C natural key to the flute, so I will continue to cross-finger or half-hole those particular notes. I spent a lot of effort practicing those in tunes, and I don’t find them problematic the way I play them now.

I’m glad to hear that the foot keys can allow for some interesting ornamentation possibilities.

I understand that many people think those keys are unnecessary due to being able to octave-fold or play around any low C in a tune in a variety of ways (as I’ve been doing), but I like the idea of having one more way to do things, and the idea of being able to ornament those notes in other ways is definitely something that interests me. Thanks for letting me know that it’s feasible.

I also do a lot of raising and lowering of notes by an octave in my variations, and I am interested to involve the low C/C# in that to see if it’s something I would like to incorporate into my playing on occasion.

Also, thanks for your input on how it affects the low D. I will inquire with the maker of my flute to see what she says, but she does very quality work and I suspect her C/C# keys are likely made in a way to avoid issues. I will see what she says, though.


I look forward to experimenting! Unfortunately I think there is quite a waiting list, so it might be some time before I can do so.