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 Post subject: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 10:05 am 
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I'm one of those people who errs away from using oil on blackwood
flutes. I've been so advised by some makers of some of my flutes.
My impression is that boxwood benefits more from (almond) oil
than does blackwood. I wonder where cocus fits in? Do people think
it needs more oil? Or is specially needy in any direction?


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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 11:14 am 
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Location: just outside Xanadu
I have several antique flutes I have identified as being made of cocus. They have bores that are nearly mirror-like. Even so, as these are older instruments, over 100 years old,I occasionally oil them, and find they benefit from it.
Bob

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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 1:57 pm 
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Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:02 pm 
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I don't know if this is of any help, but on showing a reputable flute maker my old cocus wood flute, he said that if it is played often enough, it doesn't really need oiled.


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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:40 pm 
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Appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:37 pm 
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murrough o'kane wrote:
I don't know if this is of any help, but on showing a reputable flute maker my old cocus wood flute, he said that if it is played often enough, it doesn't really need oiled.

I don't get that. Since oiling and hydration are different issues with different purposes (oiling largely to protect the bore from the effects of excess moisture and hydration to keep the wood at stable dimensions?), playing really shouldn't be a substitute for oiling. Hence, if the wood needs oiling, it needs oiling. If it doesn't (and some woods maybe don't), it doesn't.

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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 6:41 pm 
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If it is because of Blackwood's CITES II listing - don't worry. The commercial culture is what the CITES II listing is really trying to preserve, but eliminating black market illegal harvesting and trade of this and other rosewood species.

I wonder if Cocus will be listed. It was harvested to commercial extinction in the early 1900s - just the thing we are trying to avoid with Blackwood and other Rosewoods.

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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 6:44 pm 
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What I've heard, but don't pretend to know, is that cocus is not endangered.
They just took all the big pieces, and plenty of bushes or whatever remain.


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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:19 pm 
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From what little I understand, cocus is a little like boxwood. Jim is correct in saying there are lots of shrubs around. In fact brya ebenus is used for bonsai.
The stands of large growth timbers probably represented
A century or more of growth. The pore structure appears miniscule.
Bob

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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:48 pm 
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I have two cocus flutes and a cocus headjoint. I have not needed to oil the Rudall Carte. It seems very stable. I had an unlined headjoint made by Jon C. and a 8 key made by Geert LeJune (both very very nice by the way). The new wood does seem to need oiling, as much as a new blackwood flute would. Geert LeJune supplied a very clear oil, which he said was a highly refined almond oil.
I've used standard almond oil for so long I am a creature of habit. I bought a couple of bore oils, Dr's and Roche Thomas. I never did use them. Does anyone have any experience using these commercial oils?

As others have mentioned I am also under the impression that cocus wood is actually hard to find in pieces big enough to make a flute, but the plants are still out there growing. So I was surprised it didn't make it on the restricted list. I suppose the few people that are using it to make flutes aren't affecting the market the way furniture makers were with rosewood. I particularly like the sound of unlined cocus, but some people are sensitive to the wood, more than blackwood.


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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 5:31 am 
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I've used the doctors for yrs. brilliant stuff.
Oiling is partly done to slow the re/dehydration of the wood. Not as a replacement. With zero water the wood would crumble into dust!
Gently hydrate the piece over a few weeks in a hydration chamber, then a little oil...
The issue with Cocus today is that the old growth stuff is so much harder than younger stuff , here's a pic to show the difference in pine.
https://goo.gl/images/qWGo43
I did this process successfully with 2antique sets of pipes in Cocus.

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 Post subject: Re: Cocus and Oil
PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:28 pm 
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I find flutes can be quite individualistic when it comes to oiling, some need more than others.


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